3 10 43 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/3a1fe4bbb7e551640c73e174f1c4e30d.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=AI-7qruCLPo958coMxKpfoO6qqeaKTGigETUec61BnFQWmQAnun-QT8w0GjZ92qcqLdtvyanD3AD5eQtnF-qMMJqP1tk8dnykZl0%7EMXxFt0rkciE16cd9s4h4fL3FtKZMbm964Sm%7ENCnUtH6ZymqyTFUgaIqbFA6hpf-mUQiEhgsQHAHC34SXl0gJodDldgerOCBByKyznVr79Y0E8fg30pm4rrNarXD-CEOnNIm6S50gmspL12IT9JMwVuK48fUrDfwzTFVxjZxnpdWDv43xclcD7KnDAe4DZoA22FELiW-p0BgiC-KxQcVKYlpcbWyNdvXBCEzwu0C8Ht3GYOX1w__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM d9ac2c7241a4a5110507a88ae1717eb4 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Beverly Friend https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/7a9df6836cc0795f6c3095e25b7b4004.m4a?Expires=1781740800&Signature=rt87K5TmO1b%7Ef6sDbRfBBKa8mCmOOF8ViQZ3BtVg6xdQ08Wladqb6Ep-FXq-WADZa8QOhEVif3rOREJy6uHGUyyvu3EI4fPy2QZEXOXJBcFnTV%7Em0y%7Ee%7EQTWwpiKtWW7-ozKQ0xN2Dk4JuBrsx3JLP6CzwKEQ4-XUlNwIKulxrXhBcwDeajr-D-pbFRNLKznCbNmRzy3TwI0McNUYR1mrf0PgTvHNeBqL18RMPKL4YVPB8YGQ7%7E8x-s8wg1E2Qg9JhMMZzzwx-WX7UJDz5wC9dTRdW%7EIcQfVBvMki-qxzSnbONVIM%7EeN38nCtN9YGSJAt-fJTKxro7ekfAG4THcKDA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM cec35a670f16aa04ce42cc71c7c7c52a Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Beverly Friend https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/8fb06106362f1bdf928eb7b7a586db3b.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=tvjcfvuLbwQ4IwVEKJpHYxk7brHtvGldunNsDuj6iaPNCSq4noG1Ts%7Ex62dhVdp48l4CDwQ61Bs0Hqubs-zp2aCyvK1TvG-fdAWMUw3hKp5TCnc-UDs1m82bqxl-phJXuS0zzTD4bod-%7E62AkBzPqGQ-pUgqoCNpLhKRc%7Er6zNcp7Y8Ck%7ExfyO05VGgGGIie8-zYzLBTCl1hu2zmvfyqHTZIUylIx76bJ5BlcV0z85aPN4CVpbnKXLicrcQ%7Eo6O-%7E76AGmUlAzpK2LpEZ4xMtj1iKUZNhIwiAaYu4bBwPvOqTuV5j6xyfBzMUP9ESi3fTi1pFPb%7ElGKcrKIqek1bDw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM b8478f96bbf61338dd2f570d43f4d6f0 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Campaign pin https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/68c13d6a1726d4fd03ceaee315ea5acc.png?Expires=1781740800&Signature=b4zu2%7Eze1vW8ibT1poekgCglbpNC1QiLjD-Rlhnmc6TttAkf19Uw0TFHni6jRMLNGBzRuiHigfibXnqHzjnn1XdCsyEwfIRuG3pegNfQs9UMOTR7QeMOQtq0uN6j0k9bC6AMwv%7EjqcuBhRlHkRvH5wHGp24%7Elsv3i5gr%7EDw05tHsytEo5R4NKjFqZD%7E39TFXjeevdHwrwj72Bv0whG1KopxmyIFQMFyv10zCmxQ9XzEt5Hj3ntW0metlqkMtD8nLrNFtVGb07vR8vXulY2yJ9PZaQuHUOEK81rPIbgegdsOXrpR4Kp80qXoZCwch%7EIw8HM2rn5YQkn7fizIT6uX4Jw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 526046ebe9b392c2df39ccb727086368 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource James Friend https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/a41edbd207495da8a3901a9058ce1d8f.png?Expires=1781740800&Signature=VOHIHqHyiaONqLGXUNh90T-Xt6k5Eab963BT%7EcJvgmml2TT%7E%7EjP%7EcZwpqKcEOu6mQf628mtJQTqYVu9rw9BlwPCVb-Y4IHhC-3lCJrMSO58B1xQsNfLuHfrpmyjeONYvd8YSH7Z5w%7ET1yKNpLTl9-RZb6HVxDO4vA-KC9IZ7c-Ly7Y-vgqgvNQK6ikKk3SKGDjL9LAYz7bVrQrhwhXa-VPxsniamCyKOBNO%7EUJzRHB9pZSY5G2oiq0SpDc%7EKh9QD1OHu48N2w1MZzYlc9e%7Ef3ZJYkneXnQCIaYPWBCIWTwTS249DAj5NCbj4ju1Eib01IQPsSBBw2nrBhrEwlJr0sg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 9f2b26c9078f5a1e2f861a459d6e06f1 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Chicago Tribune obituary of James Friend, 1987 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/bd38349ab3d596d62ff795ea138bcd3a.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=n5inJ1QxvZCO8S2QOKmUkWmIJhlVfQsfr%7EQf79HCN6ZeFIHTwZbLbP9oJC8eL2tzwipbCC-FC4MsYtyFzC5K-nCbgOS1T9rAaYpEq9d3Yg1w3F7OdCVG8tvcixYQ0Aho0QCLYSTsa%7Eyk5bLvc%7EPPdbNTX7lTuv4-QSlbcr%7EqT%7EBndDF7J43hyQjAQbD99xRVuqAogeRJd9GH1b1hU2reWtTqhl-HYzUUGm4-g7wURzImuCChmOa7rD7j7g-54x71jLSfXUbRENLnYwkHCr0oCx4443NmtLCdRIkX78cmcCCFT2GBjNzMtkyILTAX1D3yNLdrm8VSmdZ0deoWd9hw-Q__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 6579bbc03e8777c353c7d2161276dd96 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Article about Beverly Friend and Xu Xin, 1995 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Beverly Friend Subject The topic of the resource “When [Lincolnwood] library came, there was a tremendous satisfaction and happiness. The community really pulled together.” Beverly Friend has lived in Lincolnwood since 1964. She met her husband, James Friend, while they were teaching English at the Navy Pier campus of the University of Illinois. She spent the majority of her career as a journalism teacher at Oakton Community College. She maintains a very active lifestyle, writing theater reviews, and drumming as a percussionist with the North Shore New Horizons band. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Lev Kalmens 0:01 My name is Lev Kalmens. I'm an Information Services Librarian at the Lincolnwood Public Library. Today is July 30, 2019. And I'm talking to Beverly Friend for our oral history project, My Lincolnwood Story. Beverly, thank you for being hear. And what is your Lincolnwood story? Beverly Friend 0:20 Well, I'm going to start with the day we found the houses in Lincolnwood. Lev Kalmens 0:24 Okay. Beverly Friend 0:25 I'd just come home from Michael Reese Hospital--we lived at Prairie Shores--with my brand new baby. And my husband had gone to pick up my two-year-old from Milwaukee with grandparents. Okay? And the phone rang and my neighbor Raz Haskel said, "Oh my God, you must come right now. I found two townhouses in Lincolnwood. And they are perfect for us." And I said, "I'm sorry, I can't come. I've got a brand new baby here. And I can't leave the house for a week." And she said, "My husband's a doctor. No matter what goes wrong, he will save you. You must come now." So my husband came back with his mother, and we left his mother and aunt with the baby. And I took my three-year-old and we went to Lincolnwood. And we went to Pratt between Kimball and Trumbull and found the two houses, and we bought them. And we lived there happily for many years afterwards. And that was 1964. Lev Kalmens 1:18 And where did you come from to Lincolnwood? Beverly Friend 1:21 We lived in Prairie Shores. We had apartments there. I was originally from Milwaukee, but I'd been teaching. I was married. My husband and I both taught at the University of Illinois at Navy Pier. We were a department romance. And then we wanted a house, and we wanted to be with the Haskels who were extremely close friends. And we bought them, and it was wonderful. We regarded ourselves as one extended family. She would send the children off to school, and I would catch them when we got back, where we worked our lives. We had looked in Evanston. But in Evanston, the children came home for lunch. And in Lincolnwood they didn't. So we could work and do other things. But it was a wonderful decision, the best decision we ever made. And I stayed in Lincolnwood. I'm at the Barclay now. Lev Kalmens 2:08 So you say that you met your husband teaching? Beverly Friend 2:12 Yes, we were a department romance. We were both at Navy Pier. Lev Kalmens 2:15 So what is your background? What did you-- Beverly Friend 2:19 [overlapping] We both were English teachers and lovers of literature. But Jim did a lot with literature. He ran the--I'm sure you must have a copy of this--the Lincolnwood Library Literary Festival, and that should be in your archives. And he brought Isaac Singer and Malamed and Fred Pole and Elie Weisel and Harry Patrykus and Gwendolyn Brooks and Scott Turow over many years. In fact, when he died, I offered to sponsor future series, and the library board didn't want to under one person's name. It would have been the James Friend Memorial Lectures, and they didn't want to do that. They wanted to spread it wider, so we never went ahead with it. Lev Kalmens 3:02 Yeah, it's interesting because I've been looking to do something along those lines. And I've come across those names that they were here. It's astounding. Beverly Friend 3:14 Yes, yes, we [inaudible] keep the posters. It had been a live show. We had posters of everyone. Jim's idea, which worked very well, was that the library gave an award to each one because if a person is getting an award, they're more likely to come than just to say, "Would you like to give a lecture?" And each person he asked did come. He got the inspiration from Notre Dame University, which had a junior year lecture series. But at Notre Dame, the lecturer stayed for a week. And here, I guess at the beginning, he did several days, but later on, it was just once a week. People didn't want to come Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday to lectures. It worked out separate but very successful. Lev Kalmens 3:56 So, let's go a little, you know, before you move to Lincolnwood. Tell me about your childhood, your parents--where were they from? Beverly Friend 4:07 Oh, gosh. Lev Kalmens 4:07 What did they do? Beverly Friend 4:08 I thought I had to concentrate on Lincolnwood. Lev Kalmens 4:11 No, not necessarily. Beverly Friend 4:12 All right. My father was a physician in Milwaukee. My mother stayed home. I was brought up in South Milwaukee, which I hated. It was a very anti-Semitic community. And I owe my happiness in my life to the telephone company because when I was 14, Ma Bell made it no more long distance between Milwaukee and South Milkwaukee. And my father, who had been afraid to move because he thought his patients wouldn't call him long distance, was willing to move. So I start my happy life from age 14. Lev Kalmens 4:42 What do you remember about growing up in Milwaukee? Beverly Friend 4:45 In Milwaukee? Just going to high school, finding friends, which I hadn't found in South Milwaukee, being more accepted. I was more comfortable. And then I went to Wisconsin. I went without a thought as if it was compulsory. And then I worked. And I had a job juggling pictures of small chickens and lists of where you could buy chicken dinners to be delivered to your house. And I ran the chickens down the left side of the ad and across the bottom and around the side. And then I thought, if I have to spend juggling these chickens for the rest of my life, I will kill myself. So I thought and I decided I'd go back to graduate school. And my parents said, "Yes, but you must do something practical" because with an English degree from Wisconsin, I was unemployable, just unemployable. So I decided. I had wanted to go to undergraduate school at Northwestern. But my mother said I was not as sophisticated as the Chicago girls. And I'm 84 now, and I'm still not as sophisticated as the Chicago girls. But I went to Northwestern. I went twice. I went for my Master's in '58. And my doctorate in '75. And I met Jim. He'd come up. He'd been at the University of Chicago, and he went to University of Illinois, and then University of Connecticut, [inaudible], and then the University of Chicago, and then we met at Navy Pier. Lev Kalmens 6:17 What was your doctorate in? Beverly Friend 6:19 English. English education, really. And at Navy Pier, I was one involved in a very big lawsuit, where they let 19 of us go priority granting tenure. And four of us didn't have doctorates, and the rest did. And when we weren't rehired, and it was a tremendous lawsuit, I swore I'd never be without the top credential again. So I went back to school and then ended up at Oakton for 25 years very happily. Lev Kalmens 6:43 What was it about English that drew in? What was your dream job growing up? Beverly Friend 6:56 Oh, what a question to ask a woman from my age group. I went to college to get a husband. I had no intention of a career. Everybody did. I wouldn't have gone back to a high school reunion if I hadn't gone back married. I mean, even married 10 times it wouldn't have mattered. I'd be married. I just fell into it. I like stories. I liked reading stories and talking about stories and writing stories and writing essays and giving speeches. And I didn't like the real world as much. As a child, that was an escape. And even now. It was a love of reading. But it was for the fun. Lev Kalmens 7:31 Was reading something that your parents encouraged you with? Beverly Friend 7:34 Oh, yes. They read me stories, and yes, my parents were voracious readers. We had an extensive library. Lev Kalmens 7:40 What was the first book that you remember reading? Beverly Friend 7:47 Oh, my. Well, the most impressive was my mother brought me Golden Books from the dime store in Milwaukee, when she'd go downtown. And there were a story of Lincoln and the story of Pocahontas. And I remember there was the $64 question--not thousand--a $64 question on the radio. And they asked, "What was the name of Pocahontas's father?" And my mother didn't know. And my father didn't know. But I knew, and I said, "Powhatan!" And they were so impressed, I thought there must be something to this reading idea. It's a good deal. But I remember, in fact, I just wrote an essay for something called "story worth," which asked what values you're most proud of. And I wrote about having been influenced by Pollyanna and her search for the golden lining and everything. And that was another influential book. But I read everything. My father had a wonderful book called You Had Heredity, by Amram Scheinfeld. And it had pictures. It had diagrams of two ugly parents who could produce a gorgeous child and two gorgeous parents who could produce an ugly child. And I thought it was fascinating. Lev Kalmens 8:57 So you said that you ended up at Oakton Community College? Beverly Friend 9:01 [overlapping] At Oakton as a journalism teacher, and English teacher, and advisor of the student newspaper. In fact, next Saturday, we're having a reunion of some of the people that worked for the newspaper at the Ram Restaurant, so I'm looking forward. Lev Kalmens 9:04 And you're retired, or are you--? Beverly Friend 9:16 Retired for 20 years. Lev Kalmens 9:18 But you still give lectures, and you seem like you're still active. Beverly Friend 9:22 Oh, you have no idea. I give lectures here and in Florida, and I'm a percussionist with the New Horizons band, and I'm a theater critic for Chicago online. And I'm Executive Director of the China Judaic Studies Association--I further the study of Judaism in China. And I do lots of things. Lev Kalmens 9:48 How did you fall into, for instance, being a theatre critic? Beverly Friend 9:54 I really don't know. Oh yes, I do know. I went to see a play by Harry Petrakis, who I liked very much, and I liked the play. And I was advising the student newspaper at Oakton. And I came home, and at four o'clock in the morning, I got up and I wrote about the play. I couldn't sleep, and I liked it so much. It was done by the Story Theater. And I didn't know what to do with the review, so I sent it to a paper that Oakton dealt with. We went to the same printer to have our newspapers printed, and they printed it. So I was very happy. I didn't expect money. And then three or four years later, I did another review in a similar way. But this one I sent to the Learner Papers and several others. And the paper I'd sent the first one to had said, "You could have sent it anywhere. We're not paying and we didn't care who else printed it." But Lerner said, "Is it exclusive to us?" And I said, "No." And they took it anyhow. And then they offered me the job. So I went from Learner to Pioneer, to various around the industry. I got paid, then I didn't get paid, then I got paid in tickets, you know. They said, "Don't quit your day job." And they were right. But now I'm online strictly. And you know what's very interesting? When I'm in Florida, I review for the Chicago online outlets. And I thought they wouldn't want a reviewer from Chicago. But it doesn't matter nowadays. Because my review is linked to the website of the theater. So it doesn't matter where I'm from or where the review initially appears because it's everywhere. And so they're very welcoming in Florida for reviewers. Lev Kalmens 11:32 How long have you been writing theatre reviews? Because I was gonna ask what has been the most memorable production? Beverly Friend 11:40 I'll tell you, I've been doing it less now. But I wouldn't say the most memorable production, but the best productions I have always thought were at the Shakespeare Theatre on Navy Pier. I'm always happy to go see them, to see Steppenwolf. Some of the theaters are just up. Chicago is the theatre capital of the world. New York thinks it is. But we have, what did I think, 85 theaters putting on 200 plays a year. I just came back from London and reviewed three plays for Chicago there. And it was just wonderful. They didn't ask me to, but I did Matilda and I did The Play Where Everything Goes Wrong, and I did Book of Mormon. I went with my daughter, and it was just wonderful to be there and reviewing plays too. Lev Kalmens 12:27 So, let's go back. So, you said you moved to Lincolnwood in ... it was 1964. What was the town like back then? Beverly Friend 12:36 Well, there was no library. Lev Kalmens 12:39 True. Beverly Friend 12:40 And so we used Morton Grove and we used Skokie. And then, I remember when they bought the little grocery store that stands where we are sitting right now. And then, I remember the big snowstorm and the roof fell in on the grocery store. And then we all collected money because we wanted for there to be a library in Lincolnwood. So when this library came, it was a tremendous satisfaction and happiness. The community really pulled together. So that was what I thought was really memorable. But I liked it. I like the the suburbs. I like to walk into the parks with the children. I liked it. Well the school system was big. We were in Prairie Shores, and so it was in the South Side of Chicago. And we had a choice: we could go to a private school, or we could go to the suburbs. And for the same money, we had a home and everything else, where the same money would have been for tuition if we stayed in the city. So, my neighbor Haskell's daughter was six. My oldest was only three. But it was time to move. We moved together. Lev Kalmens 13:43 What were some of the restaurants or stores? Beverly Friend 13:48 The Kenilworth restaurant is now, and then there was [inaudible]. [inaudible] and China was in that spot. And every time I would drive by, I would say, "Someday, I'm going to go into [inaudible] China." And finally one day, I did. At that rate, I would never have known what was there. And the Milk Pail for grocery shopping. And oh my god, and the Dairy Queen for ice cream. And Community Discount World. Trying to think. And of course many stores still exist. And Marshall Field was here, and Sears, which was just gone, is here. There were lots of places that went. It was just a very pleasant community. And oh, what I appreciated the most, and which was wonderful, was what the school district did. The school district ran bridge, and they ran bridge games where you were teamed up. We were all members of the PTA. And we'd play one month at our house, one month in somebody else's house. And that's how you got to know your community with this going back and forth. And then at the end, they would have a big gathering at the school, and they'd give out trophies for the bridge games. And we met the whole community and made friends that were lifetime friends from those bridge games. Lev Kalmens 15:02 So you were active in the PTA? Beverly Friend 15:04 No. My desire and my actuality had no relationship to each other. I did very little with the PTA. I did very little with the religious training. I was never a room mother. I had all these intentions. Nothing happened to any of them. But I did play bridge with them. But I was a working mother, so I was in and out. Lev Kalmens 15:28 What are some of your favorite stories from your work life? Beverly Friend 15:35 Well, I'll tell you a Lincolnwood Library story. Lev Kalmens 15:37 Absolutely. Beverly Friend 15:38 Alright. I had trouble hanging on to a library card. I would get one, and then I would lose it and be very embarrassed. So I was coming for a card. And I said to myself, "I never walk to the library. I'm not going to put the card in my wallet. I'm not going to put it in my purse. I'm going to put the new card in the car, in the rain visor--in the visor over the driver's seat. And therefore, whenever I go to the library, I will know where the card is." So I went in and got the card. And I went back and I went into my car, and I put my hand in to slip it in, and something was there: two more library cards. So three times I had this brilliant, brilliant idea of where to put the card. You see, and I can tell you today I don't know where my card is today either. It didn't work. But I was thinking of writing into "life in these United States" because it was such a great moment when I reached it and found the other cards and thought, I have done this three times now. Lev Kalmens 16:35 But going back to ... from work life, from teaching-- Beverly Friend 16:39 From teaching, I suppose the day that Jim and I got engaged. And my first class, somebody noticed the ring. And by the time my fourth class came, the entire class showed up and congratulated me. So that was a lot of fun. And he courted me with this mother's cookies. Lev Kalmens 16:53 What was the most, or what has been the most fulfilling part about teaching for you? Beverly Friend 16:59 Oh, it's all been fulfilling. I teach now in Florida. And the last class I taught had 134 students, and they're all senior citizens. And they all read what you ask them to read, or for seeing films, they are responsive. At the end of a class, they gave me a standing ovation. I feel like a movie star. That is extremely gratifying. But no. I loved advising a student newspaper. My husband had done that at Chicago State. He was Chairman of the Engligh Department of Chicago State. And towards the end, I was getting tired. And sometimes I would find when I signed a story, that I was the only person in the room who actually read the story. So by the time I retired, I was ready to retire. But I liked it, and I like teaching senior citizens a lot because they are responsive. And they do the work. And you see their joy in doing it. And the younger ones were not as much readers and not as much interested. So it was motivation was more difficult. Lev Kalmens 18:00 What institution, or where do you teach at in Florida? Beverly Friend 18:04 I teach in a place called Windmark Country Club. It's paradise. It's sleepaway camp for senior citizens. There are 8,500 people. And I think there are a 1000-seat theater. I mean, it's big. There are 19 different complexes with pools. And then, there are classes and an enormous number of activities. Enormous. And we go for six months. Lev Kalmens 18:33 So you spend half of the year? Beverly Friend 18:35 Yes. Lev Kalmens 18:36 In Florida? Beverly Friend 18:36 In Florida. For the past 15 years. Lev Kalmens 18:40 And so, throughout your career, your work life, what are some of the biggest lessons that you learned? Beverly Friend 18:47 Well, the biggest thing that happened to us--and this I don't want to forget to tell you--my husband was planning to go on a sabbatical to study Hemingway's reputation 20 years after Hemingway's death. And one of his colleagues had a Fulbright to teach in China. So the man from Nanjing University came, and my husband went out for lunch with them. And I don't know what they said or what they ate, but it must have been a fantastic lunch because when he got home, he invited Jim to come and teach in Nanjing in China. And I came home and Jim told me, and I said, "Well, you got other plans." He said, "Well." I said, "Why don't you go to China the first semester and teach, and then have someone else take over the second year while you go on to Paris and do other things?" which is what he did. And when he was there, he met a professor named Shu Shin, who was teaching a course in Jewish American authors but had never actually met a Jew ever. And Jim was the first. And Jim came out of such a reform background, that at the high holidays on the South Side, they blew a trumpet not a shofer during that religious service. So anyhow, to make a long story short. Shu Shin came and lived with us and taught at Jim's school. And Jim died during that time. And when Shu Shin went back to China, he was very worried. We thought we'd never see him again once he went back to China, he would be gone forever. But when he lived with us, if you said to me, "Come to my house for dinner next week," I would have said to you, "Yes, but we have a Chinese Professor living with us; may we bring him?" So he lived very close with us. So when it came time to go back, he put an article in the Sentinel newspaper, which said, "I've saved a few pennies, but I can use a few dimes," you know. And that he would love to go to Israel. And what turned out was that he was invited by Hebrew Union College to spend three weeks in Israel, and El Al airlines gave him an Air Flight. So when he got back to China, he gave two lectures. One was "my two years in the United States," and he got a nice turnout. And the other one was "my three weeks in Israel," and he got an enormous turnout. Andway, to make a long story short, he has become the leading scholar of Judaic studies in all of China. And this is a cover of Encyclopedia Judaica that he did, and it's been given to scholars and academics and ambassadors who go to Israel. And he's been in Israel and the United States many times. He got an honorary doctorate from Bar Ilan University. So he changed all of our lives. Now, Jim died in 1986. So Jim didn't live to see any of this. He was like a catalyst. They became friends. Jim had written in his diary, that he had a conversation with Shu Shin--the kind of conversation he's always wished he'd had with his own brother and never had, so he's very close. So because of this, I've been in China seven times. I was once honored by the university there. My children have been. My cousin is now working in the China Center at University of Chicago. I mean, everybody's life changed from this man. And in actuality, there were three people who lived with us during these years of Lincolnwood. One was an AFS student from Yugoslavia and a [inaudible]. One was a Chinese student who came after my husband died but had been his student, named Wahlu. And Shu Shin. And each of these made an enormous impact on our lives and on the lives of my children. Lev Kalmens 18:53 Tell me about your family. Is it a close-knit family? Beverly Friend 20:44 [overlapping] Very close. I have two daughters by birth two by extension--the two that came to live with us. And I treat them all the same. And they all live within a 45-minute ride of where I am. I'm very lucky to have the children nearby. And I have one great granddaughter and another great granddaughter on the way. Lev Kalmens 22:35 Wow. Tell me about some family traditions that you have. Beverly Friend 22:41 Alright. Well, the biggest one is Passover. And I always loved it. I just, you know, it's a Jewish Thanksgiving when you get together. And after Jim died, I didn't make it in my house anymore. It's a big chore. I make it in a hotel. I always come back from Florida. And I have up to 50 people or more, sitting in a large square. And my daughter, who went very religious in high school and went to Ida Crown Academy, leads it, and we have this wonderful Seder. I mean, it's not all Jewish people; several are some nuns and people we know from other walks of life. But it's expandable. If you say you'd like to come, I can I can have you because it's infinitely expandable in the ballroom at the Renaissance hotel. And also in terms of highlight experiences, Jim had many authors who were friends and like the ones he had here. Mary Hemingway came to speak at Chicago State University when they dedicated the library at Chicago State to Ernest Hemingway. And Jim wanted me to make dinner for her. And he wanted me to make bouillabaisse, and I am not an elaborate cook. In fact, I had to borrow the bowls from the bakery restaurant. I didn't. But it was during Passover, and you can't have the fish that are in bouillabaisse because it is not kosher particularly not for Passover. And my daughter was going to the Ida Crown Academy and ultra, ultra Orthodox at that point. So it was an experience. I was tempted to put matzah balls in the bouillabaisse. I didn't, but I did serve matzah with it. And Tracy ate in the kitchen so that she wouldn't see us. But it was something that I felt like I could have written up as a wild Seinfeld kind of story, you know, with Mary Hemingway eating bouillabaisse during Passover, that people wouldn't have believed, but it would have been hysterical to write. Lev Kalmens 24:30 Yes, that's something that you could just make up like that. Beverly Friend 24:33 Oh. No, I mean, it was so outrageous. So outrageous. And a matter of fact, Jim had arranged for an actor to do a scene at Chicago State University on the last day of Hemingway's life. A one man show. A man with a beard would be Hemingway. And as I'm sitting there with Elie Wiesel, and with Mary Hemingway, and with my younger daughter, Marla, Marla turned to me and said, "Mommy, isn't Hemingway going to commit suicide? And we're sitting with Mary Hemingway. How are we going to sit next to her and have him commit suicide?" And of course he does. And afterwards, I yelled at my husband, "How could you? How could you have had this play put on with the wife there?" And he said, "No, I asked her before, and she said it was perfectly fine." So I said, "Well, maybe she killed him." And he got so offended, so offended that I said that. But when Marla looked at me and said that. And she was a kid, you know, a youngster, but she knew how could we sit next to this lady and have her husband--. If a stranger committed suicide, would you want to sit through a play, let alone your husband? That was a memorable moment. Lev Kalmens 25:38 What was her reaction? Beverly Friend 25:40 Calm. Calm. Very calm. My husband in his college days, he had written a musical, To For Whom the Bell Tolls. And they had Anne Bancroft singing a demo on it. But Mary Hemingway never gave permission for them to put on the play. But my husband wrote wonderful music. And Tracy now writes liturgy. She has three CDs out of her music, mostly in Hebrew, but changing the melodies of the prayers that you ordinarily hear, which she's very active with. Both of my daughters are very accomplished. Tracy is ... I'm not quite sure what she does, but she travels to London frequently and to New York, and she's a principal with a firm that does mergers and acquisitions, so she's a financial officer with that firm. And Marla is head of the psychiatric residency program at Lutheran General. So they both are very capable women. I wanted my children to grow up to be capable, self-sufficient women. And my extended family is too. They are nurses and teachers, etc. Lev Kalmens 26:48 What are some, you know, projects or things in your life right now that you're most excited about? Beverly Friend 26:54 I got a whole kitchen table that is filled with projects. Well, you were one, that was coming here. And Tracy gave me for my birthday, something called Story Worth. This I hope your readers would be interested in. It was a birthday present. Every Monday morning, I get a note from Story Worth with an idea for an essay. Who would you most like to have dinner with, living or dead? All kinds of provocative things. Who was the most important influence in your life? Every Monday I get a question. And I answer it and send it back. And at the end of the year, we printed it in a book for the family that I myself have written. I wrote an autobiography, self printed. I did my husband's diary. He had 11 handwritten diaries of his time teaching in China. So I did that and had that published for the family. I paint, and I put out some books of my paintings for my children. What else do I do? Oh, my God. Well, I play in the band. Lots and lots of things. Lev Kalmens 27:57 Well, that's actually a great question. Who would you say has had the greatest influence on your life? Beverly Friend 28:05 My father. My father would come home from work. And tell me about the day at the office. And it was like a warrior coming home and telling about the dragons that he slayed. I saved this guy; he came here with 106 temperature. You know? Or, oh my God, I'll never forget when I was just a child: "Beverly, Beverly, come in. Feel this guy's stomach. You feel how hard it is? It's peritonitis." I mean, he shared his world. I wanted to be a doctor. He loved medicine. Every Wednesday, he came from Milwaukee to Chicago to Cook County Hospital to take a class. A devotee of education. He loved medicine and baseball and new cars, about in that order. He was an enthusiast. And he also would tell you how to run your business, whether you wanted to know it or not. But he was a terrific doctor, a terrific diagnostician. I didn't respect my mother. I came to respect her when I was older. But I thought her life was wasted. She could have done much more, but women didn't. She would have liked to work in his office. She was very good at math. He said he couldn't; it was an embarrassment. How could a doctor have his wife work in the office? So he didn't do it. So she was not happy. And whatever he did, he did with gusto and with positive attitude. So I thought he was by far and away the most important influence in my life. I still think he was wonderful. Lev Kalmens 29:37 You mentioned that you wanted to go into medicine. Beverly Friend 29:38 Yes, absolutely. He discouraged it. And I wasn't good at math, and I wasn't as good at science, and I was very good at English. Again, he wanted me to be married. He didn't think it was a life for a woman. And my daughter on the other hand, Marla,became a doctor because she said grandpa knew all the answers, and when she grew up, she wanted to know all the answers. And then she became a psychiatrist, and she was afraid to tell him. She thought he didn't think a psychiatrist was a real doctor. But he did. He was very proud of her. They shared a lot. Lev Kalmens 30:10 What has been a regret in your life? Beverly Friend 30:15 Okay. That I didn't plan it out. When I got my job at Oakton--and jobs were hard to get--I had gotten the job and I was talking to a dean, named Dean Krukke. And he said, "Well, what are your goals?" And I said, "Well, I just got this job. I fulfilled my goal." I said, "What are your goals?" He said, "Oh, well, I'm a dean here at Oakton. And then I plan to be a vice president at a school a little larger. And ultimately, to be a college president." And he was. He went zoom, zoom, zoom zoom. And it never crossed my mind. My regrets are the things I couldn't think. Another one was I was first chair of the high school drum section. I went to the University of Wisconsin. I stood in line to sign up for the band. And the director said, with a voice like the voice of God, "No girls in the marching band." And my career was over. And it never crossed my mind that I could have said, "That's not fair. I'll sue you." But I mean, the thoughts I couldn't think. I regret the thoughts I was not able to think, so I couldn't act on them. As a feminist, that's my biggest regret. That I didn't go further or even think I could have gone further. Lev Kalmens 30:16 To what extent do you think life has to be planned out? You mentioned that you didn't plan it out. Beverly Friend 30:20 I think that I just drifted. And I think many women drifted. I didn't have a goal. I wouldn't have wanted to say at age five, I want to be this and never veer from that course. But the men planned. When he said, "I'm going to do this for five years ..." It never occurred to me that I could make a plan. I was so happy I had the job, I did the student newspaper. My husband had large dreams and got smaller portion of them. I had smaller dreams and got more of them. But they were small. I write, but I don't aim for major markets. I sold the "life in these United States" to the Reader's Digest 36 years after I sent it to them, they bought it. But every 10 years, I would send them the story again. And finally they bought it. Should I tell you the story? Lev Kalmens 32:26 Of course. Beverly Friend 32:27 This was so hilarious. When my I came home from the hospital with baby Marla, I was sitting in the living room, and she was nursing. And Tracy was three and walked into the room and looked at me feeding the baby with wide eyes. And I saw that she didn't understand it. So I went into like a five-paragraph explanation. This is how mothers feed their babies. This is like kittens and puppies and on and on. And she said and staring at me, "She's drinking milk in the living room?!" And that was the shock of the story. It wasn't the nursing, it was she wasn't allowed to drink milk in the living room, and the baby was drinking milk in the living room. And I thought it was a wonderful story. And when I was teaching, I would say it to my classes, you want to try to send a story. So the Reader's Digest they pay $100. And so every five or six years, I would send it. And one year, I was in China at the time, I got a thing saying they bought it: "Was it a true story?" I said, "Yes, it's a true story." And they printed it. And when I tell my class I sold it, "Don't give up your day job. You make $100 with 36 years after it happened. Lev Kalmens 33:35 So looking back on everything that you've done in your life now, would you say that you are happy with the decisions you've made? Beverly Friend 33:46 I've been very blessed. I have wonderful children. My husband died very young, at 55, and I was 53. And since then, I've had two significant relationships. One with a man that I dated in my single days. In fact, the joke is, I promised my mother I wouldn't marry him when I was 20, and I promised my mother I wouldn't marry him when I was 65. But he was a good playmate. And then he died of Alzheimer complications. And now for 15 years, I've been with somebody else who's very nurturing and kind. So I've had three really wonderful companions, who were right for me at the different times in my life. I didn't need them. I could manage. I said at one point, a husband should be dessert; he shouldn't be the whole meal. And you know, I've been very blessed with health, with travel, with enough money to potentially do what I want to do. Very blessed. Very grateful. Lev Kalmens 34:38 Is there anything else that you would like to add? Beverly Friend 34:42 Who knows, I have this whole piece of paper. I think I've covered everything. Lev Kalmens 34:45 Whether it's about your life in Lincolnwood-- Beverly Friend 34:47 Well with the school board, when Jim ran the first time, he didn't get in. And Marla was there. And she cried and cried and cried because he didn't make it. And I had explained to her he still has a job. We still have a home. And then he did make it, and she was very, very pleased. Lev Kalmens 35:02 Yeah, you did wear the button that says "put a Friend on the school board." Beverly Friend 35:06 Yes. He was on the school board from 1980. He lived a schizohrenic moment. He was president of the school board when the school teachers were thinking of striking, so he was in administration. And then at Chicago State, he was a faculty, and he was on the part that wanted to strike. So he was on "let's strike" and "you can't strike" at the same moment in his life. So that was very, very chaotic. Jim was very happy. We put on his grave the thing he'd always said: "don't mourn my death; celebrating my life." He led a very good life. He died way too young and didn't see a lot, but it was a good life. And every year, and I just came from this. Every year in the summer, we have a family picnic at Rosedale Cemetery. We bring in chicken, and everybody brings in food, and we sit on blankets, and we talk about him. And my parents are buried there now tooThat's a good note to end on. Lev Kalmens 35:57 That's a wonderful note. Well, I want to thank you for coming down to-- Beverly Friend 36:00 Did we do 40 minutes? Did we do more? Lev Kalmens 36:01 Well, we're close. I want to thank you for coming down to the library and sharing your lincolnwood story with us. Beverly Friend 36:08 Well, I gave you a lot, didn't I? Lev Kalmens 36:10 Thank you so much. https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/bd73c2be5e3896e13fa6f5cfaccb47bb.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=ILbxIyI%7EirGmq1rs04YJh0BzmSi97WF5nftj6Y-gDLW9J926BQrAq0HdKjI7QNylENAn7rmWEQ5uw-i7vfvsOmUsArarR6%7E2dN1VrKLcXt76eoCUU9-%7EC4-1JqhXJixwvf23bZ%7E8zyKLtUrhuk2tpbEA3IwEnC%7EFe7n52q-XQq%7EAVM%7Ek%7ESOy9ttj1UEEpkDUbWdmK7AVwSRgliB86q3U9vVXplW-O67AmbV-i8nLTHwQLYDlwbYNCgi8Ah%7E8nmUsh1A9KY8wi4N%7Ezs3hNIrpKkqGs0r5z%7Evtznx4RLDWHVdMh2gUP8UZNcTO-YAIVA4dGBPZzIxJLpbac-17ingNWw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 8c5e528323ce7ca070113dca37b80ae4 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. 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Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Bob Levy https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/aecb80b2e92e6ba5b19e3c91a02cc006.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=eBgOxyxBcPPkaGxzEbxaym3eR-YxYa-Mx3nR4uU8SSq9I40nsOcq8dhPwPLa7NfBAMTzQbBPgTM2tKLn8zbnL3HDXSDvXJFo8rsMON34-l-Jjwj2Mv31wfv5v8q7c7wXH9mOCNsyw1P1fYq-BpvBOPZbug8cPJBd%7E-Ioo3TTcWaQEcwHXJGKshkcYaraSr-pomvDewOpBrmxEx4XIiNQiTSe1fPZ4%7EMSeuPt9qW8TTPna7478xO2nvJem1QXNqDGKo16dV1wY2kvQgzAudbTrx02fYXoTB90wJUPxYa2NsekwLlsv-zrS8AqiTxVdEHuXptS%7EF7WFoLkHY1dowE6LQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM cf571b4adaed889558fc74c8803281c2 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Bob’s mother, Charlotte Levy holding his brother, Michael, in front of their first house at 6841 N. Keating, 1957 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/f3380595926cea44f79479350a581fa3.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=d8-DkrkHLwNXZBYzhDsKa8QAyoAC0v5fTTBl-IkuO0so720rHs-itmBVz8rQkl18BZRvGa6D2teWA4tznskg07a2Nc12tc3jdU32adq33j3twEeeSyeTQy4gIN0t-3HR1JmlSM9bqLzGW7YN1eMxbD3FBd2%7E9wYiV79VAhyP3P7r-j9EOAcuJq55zYXhneyQgzmdQ5rOT8Lv3yaLb8U3I1QnDhJDb-Iel7XOIdcJLSohag%7Ezg0u6PDF-HKfH78E1ZyX0DHfDwNA-XaIG2kPPuJQvtHfylgI3X7-xCwsgXa2F4ROJNk%7Ew5PfHl8u3etnn-eAhjiP0a843dQIxyoaS4A__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 3b06fe54c73470d51769ad64494f0fb6 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource The 1967 listing of the Levy’s first house on Keating https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/753884503758de7f5b1884b2b4275bc4.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=L7zPvJxU%7EjCoC8SY8T6ehthJTs6C6w6EFi%7E4ZKnIY43lcLGYTPHww6gVga9X8MgZPQUATkGZEZL55SleKM3CzLlbV4mMyT-l%7EDIhfSvjOZG6hihCC111PHHjRD5s45CXXUwpfWOWRXkRijPso1hnzEBc3cIbe1lA8Nwdi%7EejIkWqG1BZjrIrt4-z5kYKAnMqCQBpO2WQUjuyGyNdiatgPQN1VerIaGh4HUi52ccVt4pJF3x0D2OIvGZ0fUY6liHJJZd2%7EsFWeXADTq-7FWOJv7LID9Li0a6aEvrlFbBz47ivHaj%7Etu3UVufvR-RdFDDdQSKt8Gt54Em8ZRkh-201zA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM d6f9aa0a5a34ee0678f2ee80d423015e Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource A 1977 listing of the house at 6705 N Kostner https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/72155bb5e5b3239cfeebf5201d6957d8.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=TAoU1lhx%7E4COX-doAR-CmD07lO2qtEnQamV-3zUomXrYlBFcOtgavCKb16gLWys5BNMzqpOom4nn3DSdks2ZizhZQC5M-T3VyMwUAZm3Rkt8g%7EmLWl19Gb6vzM1ott-Y9kFsB0%7Emm%7EN3jF9cfCXiATcE6HBJWROL4jPaggO6WeJ9TPB0835o9-3V7YLjxTerK8JOI2PSfeFqoqNGAlI0-Y%7ECU9o3jsBMn-2DUbKKDOWfD9MWGvC8X-kNrKtg4dnLoGRLQtE111jRHtEh342m-LwVdldP%7EGIEwxxgFC1Ww6guEZ8fUoN%7EG3rlSpEyTjuC4axS38DDRhXFfrNowf1bDA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM bbb241d55d68f4989ab5f652f87f28e4 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource “Barefoot in the Park” with Sandi Luckenbach as Corie Bratter and Risa Brainin as Corie’s mother, Ethel Banks. Spring 1977 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/31db2f35ceedf0908a920aea5e9f4672.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=C44hHmLBvY1sW9tBoQUM9OI9WtDTFBhufYjbCNNKLMy6y2QyQdmNw-X7G-Nra3Vyx0sVhb-4t81OUwRKZoFCmo3XVDrukGuqpqOu2N-p2i38r8h0jv7mL3ekPBJjozVfaphf0KCuk602jvAWKdTQmbkw9DRXj1LLuX47R62yzBTyVTvjrvzd88URa1dwRApqHIJQ77PkUDJeBq6eC8wMrUYsUQ-c1bWKtJj-bP1670otOIQj3N-KON5ZMmqytKjILOu2jAxEclPBm3ok0yI7BotY5kuCZMv%7EvIfXk5159kTjaZPjaeaNWFWaPVfI5iK0nkmKz-yPIC3kmuwRhx7lrQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM e794aae4b25c0e967630ff91e9ab54db Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource A stage kiss with Sandi Luckenbach in “Barefoot in the Park,” spring 1977 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/31aa35ff7be0e3a225beaa2e5cf74d84.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=GyWOQ8Rswip0CMHSg-9mjLJe6xmBl1ND66YqAB73QI7b4iBoPicucG0ewT1mU6kEg8uC0kGvIKFPKDkPNaO4nAki3uvdOSOFJbW%7Etn17wJfZLNwkLwC3gLr9UPOy7CQHftTRRzvqsLDKdUFSvccqkd8PGxMAb3UWJFD-XWC57CmmAhBXi6r3k-sdFIeW3%7ETvp5sy4TFbHfUSHFVzOdxAfJ0S9djGx7PBc00eMvtwvazhOW47U8e71NonyPttyQdX1ABbq0aE5KPYSttsYt9jlLttAm-TBKPTG48uM5-lc7SVPBf9pBtdhLSJTkfcLKLNnO-KGs5ccJvNe-iQx4C7Pg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM ec00252375c13cad5a58c9b6757bae67 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Bob Levy as King Charlemagne in “Pippin,” Niles West, 1979. Robyn Grobman (Niles West class of ’81), who played Pippin’s grandmother, is on the left https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/d6b02116d7dfec70fd964485c288e1f7.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=YrqOXh0Xbjjicvajcp6ViWXejJpM5T8tRNUg%7Eni-TIDDxiVavn8OR72sklPiMVsxK%7EZJHr9fk44O8ahXXhoaIifX6o-16TQRoDzEBp2S4DFcyuv8RaKqO-nvXwn3E3cwZuRhgg5rjRTIO-Hi7sXZOr0xpXDRT9yNF-Ujscd14Rnj8-CQfoh-h6QBi7y302RxExRNr46JtKxb9L7rMsYteVoQWW-apHDb7PZDzo9sLx4Th8iee9osdB4R3vMFEB7pTpkBfwRuFk95x0MuYPoQRkMhdxevjhEt5uqeW2-1cS76W43agWWJfI5dtwUv0EnCDTzJ2nqC3%7EDTitTf4yf9Og__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 4032dd037806f8ca3b9ec42d6e021da3 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Bob Levy (lower left) with the cast of “The Crucible” at Niles West in the spring of 1976. Cheryl Rich (not her younger sister Debra as was mistakenly referenced in the interview) played Abigail, in the center of the row of girls Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Bob Levy Subject The topic of the resource “My childhood in Lincolnwood has completely informed and inspired everything I’ve done as an adult and stays with me in the most wonderful, positive, warm ways." Bob Levy was born in 1961, and lived in Lincolnwood until 1977. In this interview Bob shares his memories of growing up, attending high school at Niles West, where he did theater, and discusses his career in Hollywood. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Lev Kalmens 0:00 My name is Lev Kalmens. I'm an Information Services Librarian here at the Lincolnwood Public Library. Today is July 12, 2019, and I am interviewing Bob Levy for My Lincolnwood Story, our oral history project. Bob, welcome. What is your Lincolnwood Story? Bob Levy 0:17 Lev, I don't know what that question means. I have a Lincolnwood life. Lev Kalmens 0:21 Ok, what is your Lincolnwood life? Bob Levy 0:25 My instinct is to answer that factually, and we'll start with some of the facts. I was born in 1961, and I was brought home from Michael Reese Hospital to Lincolnwood. My family lived at 6841 North Keating, and my parents had bought the house in 1957, a couple months after my brother Michael was born. We lived in Lincolnwood and I lived in Lincolnwood from birth until the family moved in 1977. We moved down the road to Skokie. For my first 16 years I lived in Lincolnwood, and it's an incredibly fond, warm, wonderful, free childhood in Lincolnwood that I remember. Lev Kalmens 1:10 What is your family's history? Where did they come from, to Lincolnwood. Bob Levy 1:14 That's an interesting question. Specifically, my parents had lived in an apartment, their marriage apartment. My parents were married in 1955, and moved into an apartment in a neighborhood of the north side of Chicago called Budlong Woods. You're nodding your head, which means you've heard of Budlong Woods. Lev Kalmens 1:30 [Overlapping] Yes. Bob Levy 1:30 I had never heard of Budlong Woods until I asked my mother where they lived before they bought the house in Lincolnwood. That was my parents first home together. My father was a born Chicagoan, grew up on the West Side, the JVC, the Jewish 'Vest Side,' the JVS. Then when he was a teenager, the family discovered that it wasn't cool for the Jews to live on the West Side, that the cool Jews lived on the North Side. So I think they moved to Albany Park. He lived there until his 30s when he met my mom, and they moved to Budlong Woods, and after a year and a half, and my brother was born, they moved to Lincolnwood. My mother had grown up in Milwaukee, and moved to Chicago in the early 1950s, primarily because she had lost hope of meeting an eligible husband in Milwaukee, and hoped that Chicago was fresh territory. She succeeded and met my dad and they got married in 1955. Lev Kalmens 2:34 What are your parents? What were their professions? What did they do? Bob Levy 2:38 My mom really didn't work until I was a teenager, probably when we moved to Skokie, and she began working for the Council for Jewish Elderly. She worked for the Council for Jewish Elderly for 17 years primarily at the Lieberman Center in Skokie in the accounting department. She was the accounts payable person for Council for Jewish Elderly for 17 years. My father did a bunch of different things. I guess he sort of had a peripatetic career path. When I was a little kid, he owned kiddie rides. You're too young to really remember what kiddie rides are. Kiddie rides were you put a nickel into the mechanical horse outside the drugstore. And your kid got a horsey ride on the kiddie ride for 30 seconds or a minute. Lev Kalmens 3:33 I remember those. Bob Levy 3:35 My dad owned kiddie rides all over the city. I remember him coming home at night with sacks of coins, and running the coins through a coin counting machine. Recently, somebody told me that the people who ran the kiddie rides in Chicago in the 50s and 60s had to have been Jewish mob. I find it impossible to contemplate the scenario that my father was somehow involved in the Jewish mob. I don't think he was, and I've had no evidence that he was. My father was born in 1918 and died in 1991. He did kiddie rides, then he sold that business. Then he had a business called Door Popcorn Company, and they sold restaurant supplies. He did a lot of that kind of stuff for many years. Eventually, he owned and operated hot dog restaurants in Chicago. He had a hot dog restaurant near Comiskey Park on 35th Street that he and my older brother Michael would drive down to every morning and sell hotdogs. That's it. Lev Kalmens 4:52 What are some of your earliest memories of growing up in Lincolnwood? Bob Levy 4:56 It just feels like an incredibly free place for a kid to have lived in during that period. Kids had so much more independence in that era than kids do today. I remember my dad -- I remember riding a two wheeler with my dad for the first time. I'd been in my tricycle, riding up and down the sidewalks of Keating for several years. And he took me to the church on Pratt. Do you know what that church was? I don't know. We were a Jewish family. We never went to church. It was, I don't know, Pratt. It was on the south side of Pratt, near Keating, Kilpatrick, that area. I believe it's still standing. I believe it's a Korean church. Lev Kalmens 5:02 Yes, that's exactly. That's the only one that I can... Bob Levy 5:08 [Overlapping] I think it was... Lev Kalmens 5:17 [Overlapping]...right next to the restaurant. Bob Levy 5:21 I don't know; the restaurant wasn't there. People will know what the church was in the 60s on the Lincolnwood Memories [Lincolnwood Time Machine] Facebook page. There was a great section about memories of that church. As a Jewish kid, my one memory of that church was my dad walking me over with my first two wheeler. I don't know if it was a Saturday afternoon or a Sunday afternoon; the parking lot was completely empty. He put me in the seat of the two wheeler, and he walked me around. Suddenly, I realized he wasn't holding on to the bike, and I was riding the bike. That was the first time I ever rode a two wheeler. My memory of Lincolnwood as a kid is riding my bike everywhere around Lincolnwood, and just feeling the incredible freedom of riding your bike around Lincolnwood. Ranging outside of Lincolnwood, as I got older, was always a new adventure. But, basically childhood in Lincolnwood was riding your bike through the streets of Lincolnwood to what was then known as the big park. You know, years before it was Prosel Park, it was the big park. We would ride to the big park, and meet and do stuff, and play Little League, and go to the summer camp, which I went to for years, and loved; the big park summer camp, the Lincolnwood Rec summer camp, and that was life. Lev Kalmens 7:24 Do you remember who your friends were, and what type of stuff would you guys do besides riding your bikes around Lincolnwood? Bob Levy 7:32 One of my good friends lived a block and a half away on Pratt, Dan O'Brotman. His mom still lives in that house. His mom is a Holocaust survivor. She was a substitute teacher in the Lincolnwood schools when I was a kid, and then eventually I remember her also substituting at Niles West. Dan O'Brotman's family lived on Pratt. One of my best friends from childhood was another kid, Steve Brown, who's now a lawyer in Phoenix. Dan is a tech guy in Silicon Valley now. Steve Brown -- God, I can't remember where he lived; I can't remember the name of the street he lived on. What did little kids do? We would hang out in my basement. I grew up on Keating. In 1968, when I was seven years old, the family moved to 6705 Kostner. We moved a few blocks east, and we went on the other side of Pratt. We were on the north side of Pratt; now we're on the south side of Pratt. The great thing about being on Kostner was it was even closer to the big park. Riding my bike or walking to the big park was even closer. Dan and Steve would come over. We would hang out in my basement and do dumb little boy stuff, which inevitably involved some kind of like wrestling, fighting with pillows. That's my memory. As I got older, it was going to camp at the Lincolnwood Rec. It was playing Little League, B League, A League, then national league, then American League, then Senior League. I played all through Senior League. I was good as a little kid and then I was terrible once I hit puberty, and started becoming neurotic and wearing glasses. That pretty much killed any hopes I had of baseball, but I still loved playing in Lincolnwood baseball. Lev Kalmens 9:19 Yeah, it's interesting. I've heard a lot from just talking to people that a lot of people grew up playing baseball in Lincolnwood. I didn't realize it had such a big presence here. Bob Levy 9:29 I mean, for me, it was the centerpiece of my summers. The school year was school: Todd Hall, Rutlidge Hall, Lincoln Hall. Summers was baseball and the Lincolnwood Rec park during the day -- the Lincolnwood Rec camp during the day. Lincolnwood between Little League and camp provided great opportunities, particularly for boys in that era. I don't think there was girls' softball. This was before the pool. Lev Kalmens 9:59 Okay. Bob Levy 10:00 There had been a political movement for years to try to get a pool built at the big park. The pool came at the perfect time. Do you know what year the pool came? Lev Kalmens 10:11 I don't know, actually. Bob Levy 10:12 We could look it up. It must have been when I was around 11, 12. It was right on the cusp of puberty, which for me in my life, was the perfect time to to be hanging out at the pool. Once the pool was in Lincolnwood, I think I probably was done with the day camp. The pool days were hanging out at the pool with all the friends from school, and Little League in the evenings. Lev Kalmens 10:39 That must have been in the early 70s? Bob Levy 10:43 Yeah, so I was born '61, right. So, it would have been '72, '73, '74 is my guess. We were so happy to have the pool. The pool felt like it was the answer to all of our hormonal needs. And everybody from my class of Lincoln Hall was hanging out at the pool. Lev Kalmens 11:11 Even though you moved to Skokie, you still went to Niles West, right? Bob Levy 11:14 Yes. Which was an issue. We moved, I think, after my sophomore year at Niles West, and theoretically, I should have moved to Niles East. We moved out of the Niles West school district, but I begged and pleaded with everybody at Niles West with the faculty and staff and administration at Niles West to let me continue going to Niles West because all of my friends were there. I was very active at Niles West, working on the school paper, acting in school plays. I was the PA announcer and it would have been a horrible situation for me to have to move to Niles East. I had terrible fears of mean people and bad, tough guys at Niles East. Fortunately, the Niles West administration grandfathered me. They found some loophole to quote unquote grandfather me into remaining at Niles West. Even though I lived in Skokie, outside the Niles West school district for my last two years, I graduated from Niles West. Lev Kalmens 12:17 Niles East closed in....? Bob Levy 12:20 I think the year after I graduated. I think was '89. Lev Kalmens 12:23 Late 70s. Bob Levy 12:24 Yeah. I think Niles East still existed when we graduated in June of '79. I think it was the next year. Lev Kalmens 12:34 You did theater at Niles West. Bob Levy 12:36 I did theater at Niles West. Lev Kalmens 12:37 Because I did theater at Niles West. I'm a little a little bit younger. Bob Levy 12:40 [Overlapping] A little bit younger, yeah. Lev Kalmens 12:41 What are your memories of that? I believe the teacher was Robert Johnson, right? Bob Levy 12:46 Robert Johnson directed the musical, which was the biggest show of the year. I had been acting in the spring plays with Jim Batts. James Batts, was he not around? Does that name ring a bell to you? Lev Kalmens 13:01 Not at all. No. Bob Levy 13:03 There were three shows in my era. The Fall show was Pow Wow. Did Pow Wow exist when you were there? Lev Kalmens 13:09 No. Bob Levy 13:09 That's right. You guys weren't the Niles West Indians. Lev Kalmens 13:11 Yeah. I mean, I was in there in the early 2000s. Bob Levy 13:13 We were still the Niles West Indians. The fall show, Pow Wow, was the student written play. It was the Niles West equivalent of Northwestern's WaMU show, right? Lev Kalmens 13:24 Right, right. Bob Levy 13:25 I think my senior year I wrote the Pow Wow show. The winter show was the big musical directed by Robert Johnson. In the spring was a straight play; drama or comedy directed by the English teacher, James Batts, Jim Batts. My freshman year, I didn't believe that I could sing, and no one believed that I could sing. My friends believed that I was inherently non-musical. So I was -- it was inconceivable for me to audition for the big Robert Johnson musical, so I auditioned for the Jim Batts drama in the spring of my freshman year, and I was cast in the lead. It seemed like an unheard-of, kind of big deal for a freshman to be cast as the lead. It was The Crucible. Lev Kalmens 14:20 Oh, okay. Bob Levy 14:21 So I was, who's the... Lev Kalmens 14:23 [Overlapping] John Proctor. Bob Levy 14:23 I was John Proctor. A senior woman...Deborah Rich ? No, I think that might be her little sister's name. Something Rich. She was so much older than I was, and so much more confident and mature. She was the female lead. Lev Kalmens 14:32 She was Abigail? Bob Levy 14:41 She was Abigail. Lev Kalmens 14:42 We did The Crucible in 2003 or 2004. Bob Levy 14:52 Honestly, I didn't even understand The Crucible; I didn't even understand what I was playing. But we pulled it off, and people seemed to think I did a good job. The second year, my sophomore year, James Batts did Barefoot in the Park. Again, I was cast as the lead. I was the Robert Redford role. And I can't remember her name. Oh, I do remember her name. Should I mention her name? Lev Kalmens 15:15 Sure. Bob Levy 15:15 Opposite me was another senior this time. I was a sophomore. She was a senior. Sandi Lucanbach was Miss Morton Grove. The play, as you may know, involves kissing. I was this dorky sophomore. I think at that point, I probably had never kissed a girl. Here I was kissing Miss Morton Grove onstage in Barefoot in the Park. I don't know if you know who Risa Brannon is? Risa Brannon was the queen of theatre. She was the Meryl Streep of Niles West theatre in my era. She played my mother in law, the Sandy Luchanbach character's mother, and it was an amazing experience to get to work with Risa. Risa is now I think the chairman of the theater department at UC Santa Barbara. Lev Kalmens 16:04 Oh, wow. Bob Levy 16:06 She directs plays around the world, and is brilliant and successful theater director today. My junior year I had achieved enough in Niles West theater to have the standing to audition for the winter musical. I was cast in the one non-singing lead role in that year's winter musical, which was Mame. Risa, the Meryl Streep of Niles West theater in that era, played Mame, of course. And I played... oh God, the name of the character escapes me. It was her lawyer. Lev Kalmens 16:51 I'm not familiar with it. Bob Levy 16:53 My senior year, I sang for the first time. We did Pippin. Lev Kalmens 16:58 Okay. Bob Levy 16:59 Daniel Blackman, who I've recently reconnected with, who lives in New Jersey and works in New York, and is incredibly bright and talented, and has wonderful children, played Pippin. He was a sophomore. It was unheard of for a sophomore to get the lead, the titular lead, in a Niles West winter musical. But Daniel was awesome. What's her name? It's escaping me. A woman was cast as the emcee; isn't that the name of the role? Lev Kalmens 17:31 The Lead Player, I think. Bob Levy 17:32 The Lead Player, thank you so much. I can't think of her name. The woman who played the Lead Player eventually moved to L.A. and is now a successful character actress in Los Angeles. I'll think of her name, hopefully, before this is over. And I sang. What's bizarre is Daniel Blackman, who at the time was known as Danny Blackman, his family videotaped on one night of the production of Pippin, and it's posted on Vimeo. I go back and I listen to it now. I watched the video of the performance of Pippin now, and I'm the only one singing on key. I'm the only one singing in tune in the show. The notion that like I was the non-singer, turns out with with the hindsight of Vimeo, to be completely incorrect. I wore a fake beard. The following year, I was a freshman in college after I graduated from Niles West. I grew my own actual beard, which I pretty much still have today. Lev Kalmens 18:36 Maybe we can post that link -- Bob Levy 18:43 It is password protected. Lev Kalmens 18:44 Oh, it's password protected, so maybe not. Bob Levy 18:46 Maybe not. But we can post photos of some of the shows. I've great photos of me and Risa and Miss Morton Grove from the Spectrum yearbook. Lev Kalmens 18:58 Yeah. Bob Levy 18:59 From what would have been like 1977. Lev Kalmens 19:02 Yeah. We can probably find that. Bob Levy 19:04 And some photos from Pippin. I'll send you those. Lev Kalmens 19:08 So I understand that you live in Los Angeles, right? Bob Levy 19:12 I live in Los Angeles. I've lived in Los Angeles for 30 years. Lev Kalmens 19:14 So did you go to college here in Chicago? Bob Levy 19:18 I wanted to get as far away. It seemed in my era that smart kids in high school from Niles West went to Northwestern. The summer between my junior and senior year in high school, I did the Northwestern Summer Program, the Cherubs program in radio/tv/film, and had a wonderful experience. I'd never gone to sleepaway camp because I went to the Lincolnwood Rec Camp -- Lev Kalmens 19:39 [Overlapping] Right. Bob Levy 19:39 -- at the big park. It was my first time away from home, and it was an amazing experience. I kind of assumed that I would go to Northwestern where smart kids from Niles West went. I met a kid that summer whose sister was going to Brown University. I never heard of Brown University. I had heard of the Ivy Leagues -- of Harvard, Princeton, Yale, of course -- but I'd never heard of Brown. When it came time for me to apply to college, I applied to Northwestern, of course. I applied to some fallback schools like the University of Illinois. But my goal was to go as far away from Lincolnwood as I possibly could. Amazingly, I got into Brown University, and so I went to Brown University. Lev Kalmens 20:19 Why did you want to get as far away from Lincolnwood, and what were you looking to study: theater or radio, film? Bob Levy 20:27 My dream was to spend my life working in television and movies; to work in entertainment. But I sort of felt like, okay, these are the last four years of academics that I have. I kind of wanted to not spend the last four years of academic opportunity studying what I would spend the rest of my life doing. That seemed like a waste of an opportunity. Even though Brown offers what was then called semiotics, I didn't do any of those courses. I did straight liberal arts. I double majored in English and history. And the answer to your earlier question: as much as I loved my childhood in Chicago, my childhood in Lincolnwood and growing up as part of the Chicago area, it seemed like there was a bigger world out there. It felt time for me to discover some part of the bigger world. I really believe that young people should spread their wings when they can; when they have the opportunity; when they can afford to move away from home and spend their college years living in a different part of the country; and experiencing a different cultural part of the country. That was a great experience for me. It was an incredibly challenging experience for me. Literally my first or second day at Brown, which as listeners probably know, is in Providence, Rhode Island in New England, I was walking across the campus green, and I met some young woman. We began talking and 10 or 15 seconds into the conversation she said, "Oh, what part of the Midwest do you come from, Bob?" And I said, "How do you...?" She said, "Well, you kind of have an accent." I found that so embarrassing that I spent the next two months at Brown working extremely hard to lose my Lincolnwood accent. When I come back here and hang out with my old friends who never moved away, which also includes my mother, I'm surrounded by the SkokiWood Twang, is how Robert Johnson actually used to refer to it. Lev Kalmens 22:45 How would you define that? Bob Levy 22:48 I don't know how to define it, and I'm not going to try to imitate it. Lev Kalmens 22:53 [overlapping] I won't ask you to imitate it. Bob Levy 22:56 Suffice it to say, as someone who has lived in other places of the country, it's not good. There are some charming regional accents in our country. I wouldn't say that the SkokieWood Twang is one of them, unfortunately, Lev Kalmens 23:13 Is that the Midwest Chicago accent, or is a little bit different from that? Bob Levy 23:18 It's a cousin of the Chicago accent. But it's definitely a North Shore, northern suburban accent onto its own. And it's not good. Lev Kalmens 23:30 I mean., talking to you, you sound -- Bob Levy 23:35 You don't have it. Lev Kalmens 23:36 I don't know. Bob Levy 23:38 You're a theater guy. You were a theater nerd. Yeah, you don't you don't have it. Lev Kalmens 23:44 Even though I've lived in this area for most of my life, I'm not originally from here. So maybe that's why. Bob Levy 23:48 That's probably why. Lev Kalmens 23:50 Yeah. Bob Levy 23:52 It's something that occurs in early formative years. Lev Kalmens 23:55 Interesting. Bob Levy 23:56 It's is very hard to lose. Most of those people who were born here in Lincolnwood, in Skokie and the northern suburbs, have it and never lose it. Lev Kalmens 24:09 Hmmm. I'll have to listen for it next time. Bob Levy 24:10 Yeah. Yeah. Lev Kalmens 24:10 Yeah, talk to folks around here. So you moved to LA in the late 80s, early 90s? Bob Levy 24:17 I came home to Chicago after Brown, and worked for Channel 11. Lev Kalmens 24:20 Right. Bob Levy 24:21 I got an amazing internship, the Irving B. Harris Internship in Public Television, which I was lucky to get. It was a year long paying internship that Channel 11 offered at that time. I was one of two interns that year, in the fall of 1983. I stayed at Channel 11 for six years. I was one of the three founding producers of Chicago Tonight, which is on the air many, many many years later. Six years after I came home, when I was 28 years old, I realized that as much as I enjoyed working at Channel 11, my real dream was always Hollywood. On the cusp of 30, if I didn't do it then I was never going to do it. I met my parents for dinner at the old Bagel Restaurant on Devon Street. I sat them down, and I said, "Mom, Dad, I want to move to Hollywood." My parents were amazing and said, "We knew that was your dream. We support it entirely. We'll help you however we can." That fall, in the fall of 1989, I moved to Los Angeles. Lev Kalmens 25:32 What was it like when you first moved? Bob Levy 25:35 To L.A.? Lev Kalmens 25:36 To L.A. Yeah. Bob Levy 25:37 I think I had six months of savings. I didn't make a lot of money at Channel 11, I can assure you. But I had money. I had savings that would sustain me -- rent, car, food -- for six months. Within three months I got my first job, which was a two-week freelance vacation relief gig at NBC. It was the Christmas vacation relief. It was Christmas 1989, three months after I got to L.A., and I wound up working at NBC for 10 years. Lev Kalmens 26:17 Usually you hear moving out to L.A., there's -- I mean, maybe it's more so for actors -- the struggle, getting eaten by the whole Hollywood system. Did you? It doesn't sound like you experienced that. Bob Levy 26:37 No, I can't say that I did. The first few months, it was a struggle to find my first job. As someone who after 10 years at NBC has now spent 30 years in working in entertainment in L.A., I'm a huge Hollywood booster. I think the entertainment industry is a great and amazing industry. The entertainment industry in Los Angeles is a wonderful life for people to choose. As much as it can be competitive and difficult to get your first toeholds in Hollywood, because it is a dream for so many people, it is competitive. But it's an amazing, successful, flourishing industry. L.A. is the world's capital of popular culture. There is so much activity and so much productivity. I always encourage young people who have a Hollywood dream to go for it, to pursue their Hollywood dream. As I say to young people when I talk about it, because I teach and I lecture and I'm actually lecturing to this year's class of Northwestern University Cherubs in two days, the film and video cherubs; I explain that I moved to Hollywood with a great Hollywood dream, and I completely failed at my Hollywood dream. The reason that I can stand in front of a roomful of 17 year olds, and proudly proclaim that I failed at my Hollywood dream is because you know what happened when I failed? I found a different Hollywood dream. And I managed to succeed at that different Hollywood dream. It turned into an incredibly awesome, fun, lucrative, wonderful career. There is so much activity, that if you arrive with one dream, and stumble into another dream it's the living example of John Lennon's great line, "Life is what happens while you're making other plans" because there is so much happening in the entertainment industry, in Los Angeles. There are so many different kinds of opportunities, and opportunities that we don't even know exist until we're there and they happen to befall us. Lev Kalmens 29:00 Why do you say that you failed at your original Hollywood dream? Bob Levy 29:03 I moved to Hollywood to become a screenwriter. Unfortunately, I happen to suck. I happen to be a terrible screenwriter. I wrote really bad screenplays that nobody liked. I was lucky to be working at NBC while I was pursuing that dream. Working as a writer/producer of promos -- the 10 to 30 second commercials for NBC shows -- was my day job while I was working on my Hollywood dream of being a screenwriter. So I had a backup. I had a day job that was covering my rent and my expenses, and allowing me to save money for the first time. Ironically, the day job led me to my big break, which was an opportunity that I was offered to transition out of the NBC on-air promotion department, and into NBC's programming department where I became a program executive and eventually a development executive working with writers and producers and studio executives to oversee the development of new TV series at NBC, which, in retrospect, turned out to be my big break in Hollywood. So, I failed at being a screenwriter and became what's known in Hollywood as a suit, a network suit, who tells writers how to write their scripts. Becoming a network suit at NBC in 1993, four years after I moved to Hollywood having sufficiently failed at my dream of becoming a screenwriter turned into a new career of being a network suit, which ultimately led to the career that I've been doing for the last 20 years, which is working as a TV producer. Lev Kalmens 30:51 Would you say that you ultimately did reach your dream? Bob Levy 30:57 In a general sense, yeah. The dream of moving to Hollywood, the goal of moving to Hollywood, was to work and succeed in some capacity in Hollywood. Early on, that took the specific shape of being a screenwriter. But, you're absolutely right, the overall dream was to become a working, thriving, successful, functioning member of the Hollywood entertainment industry, which I succeeded at doing. Lev Kalmens 31:27 What would you say were some of the biggest lessons that you've learned throughout, transitioning from one dream to the next? Bob Levy 31:37 Hollywood is such a personal, people industry. It's about building relationships. I happen not to be very good at that. Learning either intuitively being good at that and maxing out your skills at building relationships with people, building professional and quasi-personal relationships with people. And if you're not good at it, working hard to become good at it. Spending a lot of time and energy focusing on making the most of the relationships that you happen to be in proximity to; and making the most positive relationships you can. Because it's those relationships that are going to create new opportunities for you down the road, or allow you to achieve your best career goals. I mean my first and primary lesson in response to your question: is to work very hard at the relationship side of your job. Lev Kalmens 32:50 What would you say you're most proud of, whether it's professionally or personally? Bob Levy 32:59 Those are two separate areas that overlap because professional is personal so much in Hollywood. I was lucky to be a producer of three successful shows. I was the executive producer of Gossip Girl, The Vampire Diaries, and Pretty Little Liars. Shows primarily aimed at young females, at teen girls and young women, which was the mandate of the company that I worked for at the time. Some people have problems with those shows, but being a part of projects like those that really had an impact on our culture, had an impact on American popular culture, that somehow touched a nerve with a lot of viewers; not viewers of all demographic ranges. Men, my own age, many of them who never heard of those shows - but for the demographics that we were targeting, all three of those shows really seemed to strike a deep nerve, and engender a very avid fan base. To be part of something like that, that did strike a nerve, that will last a long time, those episodes are still very popular, and those TV series will last a long time in our culture. Having been a part of the process of creating those shows was a great life experience, and it's something that I look back on very fondly. Frankly, some of the relationships that I formed on those shows, the creator of Pretty Little Liars, Marlene King, is an amazing person. The intensity of the experience of creating a show like that or birthing a show like that is so powerful, is so strong, that either you will never work with a person again after an experience like that, or you are friends for life. That's how I feel about Marlene King, the creator and Lesli Linka Glatter, the director of the pilot of Pretty Little Liars, and many of the other relationships that I made during the process of creating those shows. I'm going to the wedding of one of the actors from the Vampire Diaries, who remains one of my closest friends. Kevin Williamson and Julie Plec, the co-creators of the Vampire Diaries, are still very close friends and colleagues in Los Angeles. Those are those are some of my highlights. Lev Kalmens 35:27 What are some projects that you're most excited about right now? Bob Levy 35:32 I'm mostly semi-retired. My last producing partner and I agreed in the most amicable way to go our separate ways. He's 20 years younger than I am, and he found a new deal to continue producing. I'm pretty much sort of heading in the opposite direction into semi-retirement. I teach part-time at the UCLA film school. I just wrote and published my first book, which is the first textbook on TV development, the process of creating new TV series. But interestingly, one of my former partner and my project is sort of getting a second wind, and all of a sudden, appears to be poised to potentially be a thing again. It's an amazing project. While I'm heading towards retirement, I feel like a little bit like Michael Corleone in Godfather III; they keep pulling me back in. If this project does move forward to pilot, or hopefully better yet series, it would be an incredible experience to have one last series. I promise it would be my last series, and then I would retire. Lev Kalmens 36:47 Bob, I want to thank you for coming down to the library and sharing your Lincolnwood Story with us. Bob Levy 36:53 Lev, we talked more about my years after Lincolnwood. But honestly, my childhood in Lincolnwood, going to the Lincolnwood Rec Park, hanging out at the pool, going to Niles West, doing theater at Niles West has completely informed and inspired everything I've done as an adult, and stays with me in the most wonderful, positive, warm ways. Lev Kalmens 37:23 Thank you. 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Title A name given to the resource New York Times, September 1963 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/5f6461b44214ea57fcc55e0f8dd7a837.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=WR2lOfRqaFoteo5ABNArSAhLOlPIgpM0yqs3iiK2z%7EXeoBK89%7E3Cbsn1WPvjNuzxM3joKbOG%7EpR6ALKxP4bdP2NzF1GXx-UBH7S9BrK-aLCmA1fclCsSLPz2DYNXZEJ3xPfnC7EY5HGaGOFaiFhvWc51f6zh3u9OepUGVLxzy56WB9l4wiK-82xRD4JO4py%7EnA2mZQemUWoDPpDwzuaBa3hM4wOjZy0cgl-h%7EbtflKv21h%7EI3qX8sPT%7EVJI-ry%7EWFNmYu3yQ9BKV3gdu0bkMPb9pny4dR2ikfQ2tBBjD2MV-v6HddTknR3eC0FXKXyVu1%7EwTLnYV1xlubThFhF1ncw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM c6c0742a45245e66417fb841bbea396b Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. 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Title A name given to the resource Ms. Fischer Monastero, 1998 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/1d6a31e93e053024f2f70bd1aef0f028.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=JUohecCVCNeFothA43514aTaNeEJgvMoEs1nGJA7Re38l-VeNjCirunkgY1NtlHqBcOIAax4U1b4vG8xLuJYhDf5yBhfMKK3Yr6-3G5VrdL8SntJ7%7EKzBkXUBS3eKxKDQDgH-1hx4X980wotkCRg%7EymxhDntoVl7O60eN%7EDIHgrClWWxZbY2BmyzETBn7lvrXQhs20ZTs8ov5BA77GQ30kEZspAPhx2OgDUz6yc-MM1HnlOvktAXI%7E6atkPWcN8XqyiTp2TAOWHmrbYKKFznATNuQys9aj-Xp5Qvcg2mIVIK%7EnMdIqE63OcCzjtk0MNCyCwEXcB8Hh-T0XQojwq99Q__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM c53cf6ca5fd4ca95fcc83c7241590026 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Salvy Monastero https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/a16cc5097943386e8392b40192ed68a3.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=rHxuh8nObJHrk1t-0EBjsxTwunl9k7MbNAijokkZJ3%7E7BBjnqiHpb6c-5VVU8paPgVeGkbwar-BPPjWZ-fOAkgbPQYMMXL4BsN0hT2dOLucRfJaXrgeojDZknz1N4dcPKYNnBlaWnXQB6QKrlZl2dTrYH238usnaTpXmSn6VdUDhUINrjbzfl7zoTJUpPn7m80k1VJ%7EoMf0IPknifC4%7EHjSW%7Ea6-4kMjUW%7EA58X49%7EI5GLib6QkVTf4j-HJqLf-NWLqZEdrxUB6a6uZqB7pg8Pl3co74vi8QtuNIbHkbvY6D7nkEsFojTcxz2Z569kp9dQH5fw-IusxJZuWQBrmd2w__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM b31850abd93d785136ace40fbdd91b88 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Ms. Fischer Monastero surrounded by her grandchildren https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/b0525cd7d87acf5d637b0ddc70139bc9.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=PiFyG1nOT9IG1et27IiQ53k7htt7VZwXtBRPn8BuhMt9KAuhr1i3BA4vp%7E1X6GpzrTWTN9OWDPzzCCdwuMdP2lR1zRx2R%7EYYt-mUOMTQhK9b44HZttQqcAjcYMHXJgBMIkDlFKjsg3Ktn4wS0T0DoG3D1JFkbXPC03qBnM1GQDfOkKNT2OkJAGSe8%7EVCA6Wh6sf3Tn1ornAgHPL60-pkbV6YjL2ccOsZkC0PFJ96dReXBiytDQw3d4u9Ik3VqYXmEVmBtTAgU43mPnw6c962WKAOXIC-DlA1bEHDtC1nSxx3Wx4XXR4mlWmOxaiShUnpVJutko-ze2d%7E63jA2saJgQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 3aab5663a96d15f6c9067a5bb48b78db Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Ms. Fischer Monastero teaching music Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Elizabeth Fischer Monastero Subject The topic of the resource “Life can be short, but you can extend it.” Elizabeth Fischer Monastero, originally from Dubuque, Iowa, has lived in Lincolnwood since 1971. Ms. Fischer Monastero has performed with the Lyric Opera, and sang for President Kennedy in 1963. She taught voice and opera at Northwestern University for 36 years, retiring in 2009. In this interview she talks about her impressive career in music, what she loves about teaching, and her close-knit family. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Lev Kalmens 0:00 My name is Lev Kalmans. I'm an Information Services Librarian at the Lincolnwood Public Library, and this is an interview with Elizabeth Fischer Monastero for My Lincolnwood Story. Elizabeth, welcome. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 0:12 Thank you very much. Lev Kalmens 0:13 And what is your Lincolnwood story? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 0:16 Well, I've been in Lincolnwood since 1971. I live here, and I'm in still in my own house. I'm retired, sort of. What else could I say? That I like coming to the library because it has become like a second home for me. And I know everybody here, I think they're very friendly. I have to be quiet, and that's hard, because I'm used to dealing with people in many different ways. Lev Kalmens 0:51 So you said you moved to Lincolnwood in 1971 ... Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 0:53 Yes. Lev Kalmens 0:53 How did you end up in Lincolnwood? And where did you come from? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 0:57 I was born in Dubuque, Iowa. I am of German background. That's the Fischer side of me. When I came to Chicago in 1962 I came to sing with the Lyric Opera as a performer from my debut in Italy in Milan and Florence. Somehow I became Italianized. And I'm at the first party of the Lyric Opera in Chicago, I met a man sitting next to me whose name was Salvatore Monastero. And Salvatore said to me, "I'm going to take you away from all this." I said, "You are pazzo" You are crazy because and he said, "Ma come che parli italiano?" Why is it that you speak Italian? I said, "I just got back from Italy, and I lived in Italy, and I got my master's degree in Italy, and a lot of long story." He said, "Well, really, well, can I take you out?" I said, "No, I don't date anybody." So that's why I'm here, because I married the next year. Eleven dates later, I got a ring on my finger on Mother's Day of 1963 and in September, two weeks after singing at the White House for President Kennedy, which my husband-to-be, would not go because he was running a new restaurant called Monasteros Ristorante at 3935 West Devon Avenue. But it was really called La Canopy Ristorante. Many people might remember that. It ... the building is still there. The tiny 44 seat restaurant is still there, but that became the focus of my life with this man, until I started to have three children in about the next five years, and I kept singing at the Lyric Opera in the fall. I did a lot of cover roles. It was not always leading roles, although I had done some leading roles in other places, throughout Italy and here in America. Then what else? What could be the next? Lev Kalmens 2:50 So let's go back. How did you first start singing? Where did that passion for opera come from? For you? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 2:59 It wasn't even opera. It was church singing in Dubuque, Iowa. My father had a very strong musical talent, but never got a chance to develop that himself. He could play the harmonica, but he was a bricklayer who met my mom in Chicago, and they moved to Dubuque in the Depression, before the Depression, because my father and mother were here in the 20s. They were married in '29 and went to Dubuque because he lost everything in the banks crashing, and he had already lived in Dubuque, Iowa before, where there was work. And having been in the First World War, and coming from Indiana, from a large family, and my mother came from a large family in Kentucky, that sort of a family thing was very strong, and it attracted them. Besides, my mother was a good dancer. My father liked the fact that she liked to dance. Then they moved to Dubuque. We had, it's all written on my little outline that I gave to you, and had a family there. I grew up there. My father could play the harmonica, as I say, he could sing, he could play baseball. But he didn't do any of those things because he was a bricklayer and he had to support the family. So he built two different houses in Dubuque and many other beautiful stone and brick houses that Bob Fischer could do. My older brother Bob Fischer, not Junior. He has also learned how to become a bricklayer before he went and got his education. We all got our education, pretty much in Dubuque, always working. Our kids worked in different ways in our family. I had a sister after Bob Fischer. I had Darlene Fischer, then I came in, then my younger sister came, and 10 years later, the last brother came. The two brothers now live in Denver. The older brother has just written his sixth book. My younger brother is a police retired officer in Denver. The two of them somehow got to beautiful Denver. My sister, younger sister, lives in California. My older sister has passed away. She was an artist, and she could do a lot of things. She was very talented, but she passed away when she was 80. My younger sister is 83 and I am 85 and my younger brother is 73 so that's about where I am. Lev Kalmens 3:00 It's a big family. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 3:07 Well, both my parents, as I say, came from large families, but that was what was necessary in the days that my father grew up in Jasper, Indiana, and then had to leave the family because they couldn't sustain 11 kids. So he was, he had to go to work right away, and learned came somehow got to Chicago after the First World War. I know that whole history because I've been researching that at the Lincolnwood Library, which is becoming my second home. Let's see - my sister is a nurse in California, and she's retired, married to a doctor who is also retired. I love traveling. I love traveling with her. She and I do a lot together. We go to visit our brothers in Denver. We take cruises; we have in the past. She's not as well anymore, and neither is her husband. And my older brother, as I say, just finished his sixth book, and I brought that along to show to you, if you'd like to see it. Lev Kalmens 6:16 Of course. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 6:16 He's a Marine retired colonel who served in Vietnam. Lev Kalmens 6:22 So how did - so you said your origins of singing came from, started with church singing... Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 6:27 It did, because in the Nativity School, which was across the street from our second home that my father had built, a brick house, with gardens, vegetable gardens, all around. Corn. We raised sweet corn, raspberries, tomatoes, carrots, all kinds of things, because in those days during the second world war time, that's when I kind of grew up, right there, across from nativity school. In second grade, my teacher was the organist in the Catholic Church, and every time there'd be a funeral, she'd call me and my older sister, and we'd have to go and sing the funeral mass in Latin, and that's how music - well, then, of course, I had to take piano lessons. My father was able to buy an old, used piano, and he could sing beautifully and he could play the harmonica. My older brother was more of a writer and artist. He could draw airplanes. I knew how to draw airplanes and brides. From when I was three, my father would sit us around the dining room table, and my mom would cook the dinner in the kitchen. And we were poor people. We were. And I learned how to be a working child of a family that always, we always had to do some kind of work, which people did during that second world war. And I remember a lot of things. My memory is pretty active, I would say now. I haven't really forgotten too much. That's why I'm writing the story of my whole life. Lev Kalmens 6:27 So did your - would your father sing to you? Do you remember him singing to you? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 7:54 He liked hearing me and my sister sing as a duet, and the two little Fischer girls would sing, sometimes on KDDH radio, we'd go and sing for the Catholic Daughters, meetings that my mother belonged to. We were raised very religiously, I would say. In fact, my mother, having three daughters, thought that one of us would have to be a nun in the convent, and because she had three sisters who were nuns, and she was from a family of 11 or 12, my father also, but his was not in the same way. They were religious in Jasper, Indiana. My mother was from Kentucky, so family was always very close, and piano was something that I had to do, my sister had to do. Rita, my younger sister became a nurse after a while, but we all went away to school and continued language and continued music. I was a pianist as a child and did some kind of recitals at the visitation academy across the street from nativity school with the visitation sisters. I know my husband thought, well, you've got to be Mother Superior. I said, "No, I'm just the mother of your children." [Chuckles] Lev Kalmens 9:01 So, so at what point did you decide that music was going to be something you were going to pursue on a professional level? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 9:08 Well, it happened to me. I didn't really happen to it. I went to Mount Sinclair Academy and Junior College in Clinton, Iowa, where my mother had gone to school with her younger sister.And I studied there - piano first. And then as a senior in high school, I started taking voice lessons because the sisters said, "Well, we have to have you singing in our chorus." So that happened, and all of a sudden my voice started to be recognized as something nice. And I would do, I did a recital as a C, as a second year college, Junior College person. And at the end of that time, my voice teacher, who was a nun, she said, "I'm going to send you to Interlochen," the national music camp, because I didn't know where I'd finish college, the other two years. My parents could afford to send me to that boarding school where my mom had gone. So I went to Interlochen, Michigan, and took credit courses in music. I said, "But I know that already." And all of a sudden it seemed like I was getting selected to do small roles in opera and choral solos with, and then I finally, several summers, I went there and got credit at the University of Michigan, and what happened? The director of admissions one time heard me sing, and he said, "We know that you're a pretty good musician, but we'd like to have you come down to Michigan. Would you like me to take your application personally?" I said, "Yes." [chuckles] Went to Michigan. Never saw the campus. Had no money. Applied for every scholarship I could get. Worked at every kind of a job, because my parents couldn't afford to send me to Michigan. But I managed to spend the next two years, and I decided to stay a third year. Because in the summers, I'd go back to Interlochen, which was where I would work. I was editor of the camp newspaper. One summer, got to sing with orchestras and choirs. At Michigan I took tours with the Michigan singers and sang in many different places. Not ever as a really, as a soloist. But all of a sudden, Rosemary College, which is now Dominican University, heard that I would be a candidate for study in Italy. I wanted to go to Germany with a name like Fischer. I said, "Well, you know." And the teachers would say that I minored in French, of course. So I had, you know, music education as a major at Michigan, and minor was French. And the way I got the grade for the French was to sing a recital in French, because I'd learned two years in college at Mount St Clair in Clinton, Iowa, and then I took one more year in Michigan, and I had to do a recital in French. And the teacher said, "Ah, très bien!" I'm fairly good in French but better in Italian, because I ended up going to Italy all by myself, taking a boat across the ocean. Traveling all by myself down through Europe, and it just turned out fine. I got to Florence. As I went into Italy on the train, I said, I've been here before. I had that strange feeling that I was in Italy before. There was something so beautiful. And I still feel that way. Lev Kalmens 12:17 So it sounds like everything kind of happened organically. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 12:21 If that's the word you want to use. Both 12:25 [Both laugh.] Lev Kalmens 12:23 Was there . . . when you were growing up, what did you see, you know, yourself doing professionally? What did you see yourself Lev Kalmens 12:28 [unintelligible, as Elizabeth starts to answer question] Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 12:30 Being a teacher of music. Getting a job. The job was always the important thing in our family, being practical and being religious, as close to our religion as we could be. And I have maintained that pretty much - raised my children at Queen of All Saints here. We didn't get to go to Queen of All Saints because they were overcrowded when we moved. First of all, I had to get married to my dear husband, and I mentioned took me away from all that. We got married in 1963 when I came to sing in Chicago after my career developed quickly. As soon as I finished coming home from Italy, getting my masters, I got a job teaching music in Milwaukee. I became Milwaukee's mezzo soprano. Taught three years of music in the grade schools of Glendale. I did a lot of solo with choirs. I wanted to sing in choirs again, because it was just a part of me. And I taught music in grade schools - three, three schools. And at the end of the third year, the principal said, "No, Miss Fischer, we think, my children are, our children are seeing you on TV." There was a Woman's World program that wanted to use all the languages that I could sing in different songs and wearing a costume. And this is a TV show. And every once in a while, she'd call me and this lady named Beulah Donahue on Woman's World, and she'd say, "You have any song in this and this and this?" I said, "Oh, okay, I got one of those." So I ended up entering competitions. But I met a wonderful voice teacher in Milwaukee who spoke nine languages and was a pianist and retired and living at Elkhart Lake, Wisconsin. So I studied with her and entered a lot of national competitions, and I started winning everything. I'm very surprised, because I think our whole attitude was, you let things happen and you do the best you can with what you've got. Lev Kalmens 12:30 You mentioned that you sang for. . .you sang in the White House for President Kennedy? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 14:21 Well, one of the competitions that I won was the National Federation of Music Clubs Young Artists Competition. My competition was Shirley Verrett, who was a famous mezzo soprano. I met her in Kansas City at the finals, and her accompanist was Charles Wadsworth from Californ. . . from New York City. And Shirley brought him along, and I said to the accompanist that they gave me, I'm sorry, but you can't play any of the music that my teacher and I have gotten together in this competition. And in and out I was coming to Chicago to do finals and this and various other competitions. And during that time, Carol Fox from Lyric Opera, heard me singing in something and she said, we should get that girl to come and sing at the Lyric Opera. So between all those different kinds of performances, I was able to go to New York. The man who played for me in Kansas City for the finals of that competition, he says, I'm not going to rehearse with you, I'll meet you at the fermata. You know what a fermata is? The hold sign. We went on and did the audition, and they created a prize of $500. In those days that was a lot. Shirley Verrett won 1,000 and was already a professional singer, and we got to be friends. After that, Shirley and I would meet every once in a while. She went and taught at the University of Michigan much later, and I had her come to visit here, and came to Chicago. Anyway, I went on, and one of the competition prizes was to sing at the White House in 1963 September. And I was married September 28. My husband would not go because he was running a new restaurant. Lev Kalmens 16:03 What do you remember about that? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 16:05 I did see President Kennedy walk through with the Shah of Afghanistan. And there was a violinist who I was still very good friends with, Elaine Skorodin from Chicago, who's been wonderful friend. She was the violin winner in this national competition. There was a tenor from Chicago. Also Alan Rogers was a winner. And there was another singer from Milwaukee who won another area. It was a national competition, $1,000 prize. You don't turn those things down in those years. So I had money in the bank for a change, and I could buy nice clothes, and I was being contacted to sing solos with orchestras throughout the United States. I didn't sing as much with, well, I did a couple concerts in Italy with orchestra, but I didn't have a manager. I never wanted a manager. They wanted me to audition for the Lawrence Welk Show. [laughs] One time somebody said, "Oh, Elizabeth, you should be his dancing, champagne lady or something." And I said, "No, I don't think that's going to be," I'm not a good dancer like my mom, she was a good dancer. So no, life went on. And when my husband would not, he said, "Well, we're getting married September 28." I said, "Oh, okay." He planned the whole wedding, and that's it. And then I moved to Chicago after that, and I've been here ever since. Lev Kalmens 17:26 So what was your . . . Did you have any role in the in the restaurant? Part of the family business? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 17:33 I brought music. I brought music to the restaurant. Because my husband's older brother, Joe, who's still living in Lincolnwood, Joseph Monastero, Sr., and I actually was a very - I gave him a special gift. I introduced him to a girl that was a student of mine, when later, a few years later, after I had three children, I was invited to come and teach at Northwestern University, which I ended up teaching there for 36 years. They said, "Well, we'll have you fill in for a year." I had the three kids at home, and they were just going into school in Lincolnwood. They went all through the Lincolnwood schools because there was no room in Queen of All Saints. Well, I ended up teaching music in the CCD program. That's the Saturday and Sunday programs that they have for children that are not in the school. And that's how that sort of happened. And I went to teach at Northwestern, and about the second or third year, I said, "They don't know how to sing in Italian." And I, Miss Fischer, teaching at Northwestern for one year, ended up being 36, so I must have done something right. And a girl came in to me, and she, her accompanist friend of hers brought her, and said, "You need to study with Miss Fischer. She'll have you singing the way"- she, because she this girl was playing piano for my students and me at my lessons. And who came in? A young lady I introduced in our competition, which we started for Northwestern students, which was called the Bel Canto Foundation. Bel Canto means beautiful singing bel canto and that started, and we lasted with that for about 40 years through our restaurant, which was devoted strictly to Italian and Sicilian, Siciliano, food. And people who live in Lincolnwood probably will remember Monastero's. It is no longer there, because we sold about two years ago. And I never really worked there, but I would sing sometimes with my husband, because he liked to sing. And who came along my second year at Northwestern? My younger child, Roberto Monastero, so I have Sebastiano, I have prima. I have Maria, then I have Sebastian, then I have Alicia. Alicia sings with Symphony Chorus under Riccardo Muti, whom I'm crazy about. He's a wonderful Italian conductor. Alicia teaches at Deerfield High School. Her final concert is tonight. I'm going to that. She's almost 30 years at Deerfield High School. Beautiful voice. Maria also could sing, but she ran the restaurant and helped my husband a lot. Sebastian lives in Glenview. He has two children. He has an outstanding second child named Salvatore Monastero, after my husband. And he plays clarinet beautifully. So now you hear practically the whole story. Roberto became Chicago's best DJ, and he lives in Skokie. Maria lives in Skokie. She's the first. Sebastian lives in Glenview. Alicia lives in Libertyville, and Roberta lives in Skokie. So they're all very active. They grew up in Lincolnwood, went to the schools, did some things in music. Alicia, more than anyone. So that's that's about where I am right now. I'm going to her concert tonight. Lev Kalmens 20:42 So it sounds like you're, you're, you're, you have a close knit family and they live nearby... Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 20:45 And that is what is so attractive about the Italian culture and the Sicilian culture. That seemed to me an answer to something in me. Although I'm really of German background, and my mother's name was Cash and my father's name was Fischer. My mother is on the branch of Cashes that Johnny Cash sort of came from, and James Cash Penny. That's Cash. That's the name. And so I've done genealogy club here at the library. I'm starting that, to do a lot of that, and I'm finding out about that, which is very interesting. Lev Kalmens 21:20 So. Hold on one minute. So, Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 21:22 yes Lev Kalmens 21:22 So are you saying that your mother's side of the family? So the whole the Cash family Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 21:28 Came from Scotland and England. My father's family came from Frankfurt, Germany, Fischer, and settled in, eventually, Indiana. My mother's family settled. My grandfather was born in 1864. I've been doing all this research because it's interesting. Lev Kalmens 21:43 Absolutely. Well, you mentioned Johnny Cash. I just wanted to... Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 21:46 Oh, yeah. Mother met Johnny Cash on when he was on a tour. Lev Kalmens 21:49 Oh, so, but so was it, was there... Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 21:51 No, We don't think, Lev Kalmens 21:52 Okay Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 21:53 There were two Cash brothers that came from Maryland and settled in Kentucky, and then we lost track of one in the genealogy study. But my grandfather settled in Fancy Farm, Kentucky, and raised 12, 11 or 12, children, and I'm still very close with a lot of them. So family, in that case, was very close, both sides. My father's family, not as much - they were very poor. But my father had the work ethic, which is strong in all of us. Mother, Mother will always work too. So work and music and God in heaven. Lev Kalmens 22:24 So tell me about your, So you, you were at Northwestern you said for 36 years. What were... Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 22:32 I was a professor of voice and opera. Lev Kalmens 22:34 What, what were some of the highlights of your career there? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 22:39 Well, other than bringing the Italian repertoire more into the school and being recognized as someone who could teach that a lot. And we started the foundation, Bel Canto Foundation. Started as the Monastero Award at Northwestern. And all of a sudden, five other universities in Chicago said, "What's wrong with us? Don't we get to have a prize?" Oh! So we happen to have banquet facilities by that time, and we could have a place Lev Kalmens 23:06 At the restaurant Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 23:06 At the restaurant. We, even though I never really worked there, I would help audition singers from these different schools. But I never really judged, because it wouldn't be fair. I was teaching at Northwestern. So that's how that kind of developed. And then Martha Monastero married my brother-in-law. The young girl married, and I gave him a wife. You know, I'm just doing my duty in family. And she's very proficient in Italian, Sicilian, raising her children, who are musical as well. And everybody worked at the restaurant at different times, my children and their children too, and so we see each other quite frequently. We have a club called the Sicilian American Cultural Association. Lev Kalmens 23:50 What are your memories of Lincolnwood? And you know you you said you moved to Lincolnwood in 1971... Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 23:56 We lived in Rogers Park, in the family building, a three apartment building. We was on the third floor, and I had three babies up on the third floor, and the laundry, in the basement. And out of the opera career. I still would sometimes go to sing support roles and rehearsals and things downtown. I didn't have a car by that time, and I had already had owned a few cars in Milwaukee growing up and being a singer, but love came into my life, and love took over. So that's what happened. We moved to Lincolnwood because I said the third floor is too high and the laundry is too low, and I want to get into a house with a yard, a bigger yard, for my children. So I started looking around, and I surveyed about 150 houses. I found one for my daughter, Maria, which she still lives in. Where else? Then I looked in Lincolnwood, and we found the house that I still am in. Lev Kalmens 24:49 What was, what was it about Lincolnwood that attracted you? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 24:51 It was that, well, Lincolnwood Terrace area. It was a brick house like my father would build and did build in Iowa. And he actually, before I moved into Lincolnwood, my father passed away, and I was sad about that, because he would have enjoyed the house that I'm in, and I'm still in brick and stone, and it's the right place to live and to raise a family. That's what attracted us. And the restaurant was close Lev Kalmens 25:21 Right, right. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 25:22 Across the street on Devon. Lev Kalmens 25:25 What have you been doing since your retirement from from Northwestern? I know you teach . . . You still teach children? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 25:32 I teach preschool. I taught preschool when my Maria, my oldest daughter, had two little boys, and she said, "Mom, sister Hillary doesn't have anybody to play the piano for her preschool, three, four and five year old children, you've got to go there on your way to Northwestern." Oh, okay, and I did that. Then I met another nice lady named Bonnie Shanahan, who probably lives in Chicago area, and she was teaching at Tiny Tot preschool. My son Roberto, had to be taken to a preschool, so I didn't take him to where I was already playing. I took him to Tiny Tot and the director there said, "Oh no, no, no, he's going into the four year olds" because he was born after I went to Northwestern and he could get up and sing. He was eight years younger than my third child, Alicia, and he'd get up at the restaurant and sing when he was three. She said, "No, he's going to go in the four year olds." So about 14 years after that, I would teach on Tuesday and Thursday at Bonnie's school. I loved teaching little children all the time. And I taught at Queens, and I taught at Tiny Tot preschool. And now I'm still teaching with Sister Hilary at her school in, where she uses a kindergarten room in Skokie. Lev Kalmens 26:45 What is it about teaching? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 26:47 Music makes children happy. Languages. A friendly personality who shows love for them and teaches them. And I support Sister Hilary, who is the teacher of the class. I do the music time, an hour, two different classes. She has about 24 children. But at Tiny Tot, the earlier one, I can't go there anymore because they have little babies who have more germs. [laughs] Oh, I don't know. I would spend more time at the Tiny Tot preschool with touching the children and carrying a piano keyboard around so . . . Lev Kalmens 27:22 And as far as just you know, you know, Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 27:24 I loved Lev Kalmens 27:25 Teaching for 36 years at Northwestern . . .What? What about that kept you going for so many years? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 27:31 Well, I have a lot of successful students. One became a professor at India- at Illinois. Another one was teaching. I've got several who are still performing in Europe and throughout the world. I had the young lady who did "Porgy and Bess" when they did the reproduction of it in London and Glyndebourne in England. That's Cynthia Hayman. Now she has just decided to quit teaching at University of Illinois. I have a man Victor Benedetti, a good Italian boy from California, who is, has his own musical theater school. After making his debut in New York City as Don Giovanni and singing at the Lyric school and Lyrics performing various things, he went off to France, and he's got his own school in France, and has two grown sons. I have a lot of contact with my former students. I would, was going off doing master classes and teaching voice lessons at some of these various universities, University of South Carolina, Florida, Ave Maria University. I can't even remember all the places, but it's all in the book that I am trying to write at the Lincolnwood library. [laughs] Lev Kalmens 28:41 What have been some of your favorite operatic roles to play? Lev Kalmens 28:48 Well, I did "The Medium," and I'll show you my picture of that one of these years. It looks like a drunken seance conductor, and that's what I learned at the National Music Camp. When I went to Michigan, the first summers I went there, they picked me out and they said, "We think you can do this role. We'll give you a pianist to help you learn the role." So in 11 sessions with that man, who was a wonderful pianist, I memorized "The Medium." And I scared those people. She really scared them. Then I also did something, which, by Leonard Bernstein called Trouble in Tahiti. If you look at the Ravinia summer programs dedicated to Leonard Bernstein, whom I also met in New York at one time, I found out that they're doing Trouble in Tahiti this summer at Ravinia. I premiered it. Lev Kalmens 29:40 Wow. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 29:40 In Interlochen, when it was first written. What a movie! What a terrible, awful movie! And I'm gonna go and see this and sing the whole darn thing in choir Lev Kalmens 29:50 In the audience Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 29:51 At the Murray Theater. So that, Ravinia, I was the first singer under the new roof of the big theater. I sang there, winning the, one of the prizes, in the Michaels Award of the summer of 1962 before I went back to make my debut in Italy, and I sang there having won that prize. Ah, you know, there's, it was just one thing after another. It just all started to happen. One thing really led to another. And the competitions, people would say, I never went under management, though. I did not want to have someone else telling me where to go, because I was getting a lot of performing experience, and I just really liked going back to Italy. Eventually we had a home over there, the Monastero family. We bought a home, farm home, outside of Florence. Florence is my heart. My granddaughter, Alicia's daughter, is going to study one semester in Italy, but she has to go to Perugia. Lev Kalmens 30:46 Mmhm Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 30:46 And I said, "no, devi andare a Firenze," you have to go to Florence, because that's - she's, "Oh, Nonna, I know that." They all call me Nonna, which means grandma, Lev Kalmens 30:54 Right. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 30:54 So, yes. So she's going next year. She's a sophomore at University of Minnesota. Her older brother just graduated from Indiana. My Maria's oldest son graduated from Bloomington, Illinois, university, Illinois there. And he's a teacher in the school where my two youngest granddaughters are going to school in Skokie. Would you believe it? Lev Kalmens 31:18 Oh Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 31:19 Yeah. So I have nine grandchildren, and I brought their picture to show you, and they're very sweet kids. We get together, we love - this is what I like about the Italian culture. The family is very important. And that became very obvious when I met my husband, Salvy, and I met his parents, and they said, this girl, "Questa Signorina, parla Italiano," she speaks Italian, but she's German. I said, "Well, yeah, I kind of lived in Italy, you know," because I spent a year getting my master's there. And that was really, that's what did it - God took me there. I met Pius XII in a private audience, because the school I went to was a Dominican college called Pius XII Institute, and we got to go down to Rome. I was in his office with the people that were the students at this school in Florence on December 8 of 1956, the year I got there. That's a long time ago, so you can tell how old I am. And I met Pius XII and he said, "Well, where are you from?" I said, "I'm from Dubuque, Iowa." "Oh," he said, "I know. I was, I've been to Chicago." Oh, my God. And he was a wonderful, saintly priest, very tall. So I'm very devoted to a lovely saint called Pater de Pio. That's the saint who has the stigmata of Jesus Christ. So I'm quite religious, and it's too bad sometimes people think that can get in the way. No, no, no, it guides the way. So shall I give you a sermon? [laughs] So that's about where we are. Lev Kalmens 32:50 What are some life lessons that you've learned throughout your life? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 32:53 Haven't I told you enough yet? Oh, my goodness. Life can be short, but you can extend it, and I am lucky that I have the health, although, you know, I have normal health problems. For an old lady. I'm not - I don't feel like I'm that old, because my memory is quite good. Lev Kalmens 33:11 It certainly seems like it. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 33:12 I think so, because I am writing my memoirs, and it's called "A Life of Love and Music." And it used to be a life of music and love, but when love came into my life, I had to turn that around. Both 33:25 [Chuckling] Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 33:26 So that's exactly what's happening now. And there are many lessons that you learn as you're going along. I hope I've transferred them to my children. I'm very proud of all of them. Lev Kalmens 33:37 Well, that was gonna be my next question is, what are you most proud of? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 33:40 My children. I think, my children. And my grandchildren, nine grandchildren. Lev Kalmens 33:45 Wow, Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 33:45 Yeah, each of them have two, except Alicia has three. She has an Italian husband too, you know. And so she has this girl that's at Minnesota, and one that just graduated from Indiana, and a young one who is a top volleyball player. And other, he's 15, like the 15 year old of my son, who is the clarinet player and can jump higher in all kinds of things. He's, he's a gymnast as well as a clarinet player. So, music is going along through the family. The two little ones, my young, young son, Roberto, is married to a Filipino girl, and as I say, she, the two younger grandchildren are in the school where my oldest grandson teaches. Lev Kalmens 34:25 Has the kind of, the commitment to music in your family? Can that be mostly attributed to you? Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 34:32 Oh, well, my husband thought he was a good musician too. He couldn't really do as much, but I let him think. you know. [laughs] His brother was more musical, actually, Joe, his older brother was more musical. Who was a good accordion player, but he also was a good cook. So between music and food, you know, and religion, we've managed to pull it all together. Lev Kalmens 34:57 Those are both very beautiful things, to dedicate your life to. Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 35:01 I think so. My husband thought I was Mother Superior, as I probably told you. [Laughing] not really, no. But my husband passed away in 2003 but he's with me all the time. Me with my dear friend, Padre Pio. I think they look down upon me and I am guided to do a lot of things. It just happens that way. It happens. Lev Kalmens 35:24 Well, I want to thank you for Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 35:26 Is that enough? Lev Kalmens 35:27 coming Both 35:27 [laugh] Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 35:28 You want to see my book? I brought all my pictures. Lev Kalmens 35:31 Yeah, well I will include your pictures on our website, but I would like to thank you for coming down to the library and sharing Elizabeth Fischer Monastero 35:35 I'm here almost every day except Sunday. It's too busy. I can't get to the computer. Lev Kalmens 35:40 But thank you for sharing your Lincolnwood story with us. 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Title A name given to the resource Felicia’s Niles West High School ID card https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/be3427f6782b009ba5f5e287ae88cf37.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=dREnFr1aSNqJ5F1LMXhIsCToFt-cjm6j5CO98NHx8uSraGfTMlBWrpSpIUjyrMkq2pnsiM3GfNRX0u0jMwK7UQSkt8ZA0EW206VVjpN4MAkZSvXG821coXE0q%7EYTusMRy15hJqzB15rOykW1BlBABc1EhpESaXw2nppkuii9W3wpnYo486m1ZBGEaLEkt9edo4fqnXrHhhrzY4PqqMflBbEGtMhtyNxbWsCnx5YUc9soh2ye6ce4k4OkLD%7E7g%7EMUwX5g1beCp3%7EBHr3IfwtG5e3sjJRrQIWcJ0CRyCBtvhHutg30UCeJMr-YqgUjfQpvS-uxprCPXRCLJCTvss3gPw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM e260767a8531552c3ec7957cd8eff84c Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Felicia, at home in Lincolnwood, August 1966 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/b0e6df11e8b7ed1a9ed7416a96528309.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=guDNyjAPaVQ-pgiStRn6eX0Y%7E5h6kqdAhAUSRVi3yqhPULRycESQSofSS5tKvbZN9XlqKuWOeuJNdYjmXQULgRhqBOjSKtNPldgU5PDr1btqy3I2qOIN1OlBGSe9cHORhl3FdE0BLkXfqM6qPdfQ-GDpkfHS-Ek15uKeeDo66tq%7E4tocO5UwNrUcssKeY6V%7EdM%7EOrjJhHxhOUtcfooPd9XPXtVb5fQwdExMzoI3bVvQc7FViAdVm8ZWagrEA1iNpAIMocuQ1VKqKCQ6%7Eu67rDxen7pqT5E8YkmY-BWvXSYQilty9Do02n4vYwDLxkA2EfiecnBj-XU2tdqEkjSZs-Q__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 8d9270558c01946a4c9edd56066f5c71 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Felicia’s father at Expo 67 in Montreal, Canada, 1967 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/30f9d497a869b01995c154d6a1fad804.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=HwRBcxcyqQnD0BTQwAWteO0oaLwyUa5UizLqw8AeGRKTG-xC48LMUy9QYki4yTfZloo6eop4O3crMjohnH1kkD-pkKmZO9ks1Xx8zWzqLCnBSOWjYNZAmsw1wFRd02ahIE4dd9XwSYomHYI08PJcv-pTbW56Vk56sPfQAtujzT-6X7Mv3AR9Tvzd24plJ6n4WJHQekJ2jW6uIYRgBwC7m78PftSw2zagzQSOzjBb3laxBnb3hem3Y0R8Sw9HerglcA3PkhD5r-D2SEzze3FlwIUCZFWN82oBjpu8m3j1AAe3b%7EIK9MBOHBkpm04-zWTyyis3E90a-DkVP%7EdHj3xZOg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM b2674c187e8f1836e7f6008803c42dc1 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource At home, 1971 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/41c9f448a58191b1c326319f246a2353.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=NyZ77ybUay7%7E8W4HGv0MopHriUm-dcYAzxPDHfr3rLGxgJiXvEVLiJSZ1t4iyzXFn1tSuHJZO4Mx0jt3cxHeIXXJDReb9crlTcPuQCJVCsNWPSs6IrAaKYRgCTyVtHv0%7EYZzJ-SX7GFprATejc6o3oEpwc7kkQoyFG0lStJ11xMwIvpnyLQq8%7ED%7EU3-N0gc3STYm8ZkdW0RdwLefiG5OoJE06H5ucUIk9b50yTRVrsWdqasNaImZLeZEUFzEChQ3evyNFBvw0SFhm-PJ1dii1Q6y7qY0ZCmOp%7EMFN2iw1G-aH0vknjb-PosREwx7Qi-3UrH30r-vqSD5dLeETRyGTg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 9bac0fc0fc15dad31fb1e5a583b7f452 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Felicia at Expo67 in Montreal, Canada. August 1967 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/d22666855aa842c1033842904066e3cc.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=R2376VvaHkyRsABSbNgtyZT0vTEhIDmndJNljUxHzsi4K6E5Q6IQhpEFL3nk9iBh6fVaH70L1N0WuUN7Cl4LZcRpxtgyYjcZzWKuENnKILD92TCAvA65xu8yhxbzh8Sds9tEAV1z%7EvKQgzv%7EE405Zo16QnNbMphl02NrfPG6dCrBS0zEQARzfjwguLqLP31Er2OoNprwRDiB1mgrNUr8EPCsXjaMBnaZghdwYNxENyaMOKPL5CZJbht5RJu3u-QnNBys4bTF-HtMGrHinDAmAnJQMCtYd68PuNOfmyN8aUYq2QKstPjqOAfE1nPTIecrxnDxGEzTAg%7EsuNn8wDBS8Q__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 155830df1cee1d3d19c1118cabc0667f Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource The Kaplan’s house at 4355 W. Jarvis in Lincolnwood, 1969 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Felicia Sue Kaplan Subject The topic of the resource “[Lincolnwood in the early 60s] was a lot quieter, a lot cleaner, not as many people around.” Felicia Sue Kaplan talks about her life growing up in Rogers Park, moving to Lincolnwood in 1960, attending Lincolnwood schools, the different jobs she has held as well as her passion for creative writing, and storytelling. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Lev Kalmens 0:00 My name is Lev Kalmens. I'm an Information Services Librarian at the Lincolnwood Public Library. And today I'm interviewing Felicia Sue Kaplan for My Lincolnwood Story, our oral history project here. Felicia, welcome. And what is your Lincolnwood story? Felicia Sue Kaplan 0:18 Well, we were a happy little family living in East Rogers Park in a big beautiful house when I was little. And with my parents and two older brothers, never any pets. Except a little bit later, I had a parakeet. One day, the teachers asked my parents to come in and suggested that we move to the suburbs. I don't think they had any particular suburb in mind. But it was a requirement to my parents and my mother's sister and brother that all of my grandmother's three children live within 30 minutes of her house, so they could be on call and available to her at any given time. She was very authoritative, bossy, survivor type, actually lived longer than anyone in the family to be 100. But it was required that her kids live within a close proximity, and they were not all allowed to be out of town at the same time. So my parents started looking at homes in Lincolnwood, which is very close to the city. And Bubby lived in Albany Park at the time. She actually lived there until her late 90s. And then she was in a retirement center. So they started looking at homes, and Dad purchased a home at--Do you want me to give him a specific address? Lev Kalmens 2:41 If you're comfortable with that, sure. Felicia Sue Kaplan 2:42 Yeah. The house is still there. It's 4355 West Jarvis. It's on the corner of Jarvis and Lowell, and it was very nice: spacious home, no basement--but it was called a bi-level--and two-car garage, and each of us had our own bedroom. But, for me, it was very, very difficult to move from our little local neighborhood to the suburbs. So at age 10, I was in a new house in a new suburb with all new friends, a new school, and the school was definitely much more accelerated than public school in Chicago. I went to Hayt Elementary School at Granville and Clark, and it is still there also, but they have enlarged. And it was a little neighborhood school and everything was fine. And then I'm thrust into Lincolnwood, and it was very traumatic for me. It was very, very difficult. And fortunately, my brothers were very helpful in terms of tutoring me and helping me to get my grades up. Lev Kalmens 4:37 What year did your family move to Lincolnwood? Felicia Sue Kaplan 4:41 It was 1960. Lev Kalmens 4:48 What were your earliest memories of Lincolnwood. Felicia Sue Kaplan 4:56 It was a lot quieter. A lot cleaner. Not as many people around. It was these houses that were lined up on the street. And, little by little, I got to know our neighbors. Fifth grade, I was very fortunate to have a teacher by the name of Valentina Furlett. And it was somewhat similar to a special needs classroom. Just about everybody in the class had some kind of issue or problem, and I guess they realized that I was having a lot of trouble settling in. And I'm very grateful to her. One of the biggest, most memorable events of my entire elementary education is that I was elected class president in fifth grade. It was a really big deal for me. I tried not to let it go to my head. But, considering how difficult fourth grade was, it was a major achievement for me to to get that honor. And I tried to help as much as I could. Slowly things were falling into place; my grades got about a lot better. I have a lot of memorabilia with me, including my fifth grade report card. And because this teacher was so special and helpful and important to me, we kept in touch with each other, definitely in a writing form for about 30 years. And I visited her current fifth grade classroom a couple of times, and she let me interact with the students. I did not go to Todd Hall, that was K through three. Rutledge Hall was four, five, and six, or four and five--I'm not sure. So I was at Rutledge Hall for definitely four and five and then Lincoln Hall, which was actually built first. I don't remember if I was there for six, seven, and eight, or seven and eight. But by seventh grade, I was definitely developing some good friendships and getting to know my my classmates a lot better. Another highlight of eighth grade is I won the Midwestern Spelling Championship, and the tiebreaker word was a South American country by the name of Uruguay. Capital U-R-U-G-U-A-Y. And many, many years later, we just happened to hire a babysitter who was from Montevideo in Uruguay. U-R-U-G-U-A-Y. I was a really good speller, pretty decent writer, good in math, not so interested in science and social studies. Lev Kalmens 9:09 Why was the transition from moving into Lincolnwood, going to the school such a hard transition for you? Felicia Sue Kaplan 9:23 Everything was new, different. I didn't know anybody. It was all new. And to this day, I think I mourn the death of the house that we lived in, in Rogers Park. It was three stories. It was huge, with an attic and a basement, a full furnished basement. And Dad was having trouble selling it, so they knocked it down and built a 12-flat, which was the bane of his existence for many, many years. For eight years he rented to crazy people in that apartment building, until my mother finally said, "You're either gonna sell that building or we're getting divorced." And so he sold the building. But in my subconscious, and I didn't realize this until many years later, I got jobs that were in former homes. I lived in a converted house in East Rogers Park many years later. I just was constantly trying to recreate that feeling of the big old house at 6315 North Hermitage in Chicago. And I still miss it, don't have too many pictures of it or of me at that time. Lev Kalmens 11:19 Tell me about your parents. Who were they? What did they do? Where were they from? Were they originally from Chicago? Felicia Sue Kaplan 11:28 My mother's parents were from Lithuania. And when my mother's mother was 10--and I've shared this story with a lot of children who were pretty fascinated to learn that my Bubby Esther came to America at age 10 with the clothes on her back and a $20 bill, and eventually got off in Ellis Island (as did a lot of other people) and was received by different relatives. Fast forward many years, they moved to Benton Harbor. It's not clear to me if she met her husband in America or in Lithuania, but she got married at age 18. In the photograph of me playing the piano, there's a photograph above the piano which is her wedding picture. Unfortunately, they weren't married very long. He was killed in an accident when she was 32 years old, I think he was possibly 34. And they had three children. So my mother at age nine became the primary caregiver of the family: cooking, cleaning, shopping. And my grandmother just made do. My father's parents were born in Chernigov, in Russia, pretty close to Kiev. You might be familiar with that. My older brother, Ed, has been to the little town that they were from, and there's very little there to recognize. But I think he took some pictures at the time. And they didn't keep a whole lot of records in the late 1800s, so there's not a lot to go on. But I just was told that it was fairly close to Kiev. I never met my father's mother. She was already passed by the time I was born. And in the Jewish religion, the children are typically named after someone who was deceased. And my father's mother was named Fanny. And I said no way am I going through life with a name like Fanny. But that name was very popular in the generation that she was born in. I don't have the exact year off the top of my head, but I have it at home, being the family historian. And I do have a lot of pictures of them. My father's father was still alive, but I was a baby and I really have no memories of him. Lev Kalmens 15:25 Before we started talking, you showed me a lot of photos and a lot of memorabilia that you've collected over the years. What were you like as a child? What were your hobbies? What did you enjoy doing with your time? Aside from school. Felicia Sue Kaplan 15:45 I had a lot of trouble with my eyes as a very young child. My mother told me that I was already wearing eyeglasses. By the time I was 11 months old. They didn't really have glasses for kids that little. So she said that they took two lenses and hooked them together with a ribbon that they tied behind my head. When I was three, I had my first surgery. And then I had another corrective surgery when I was 16. But I've worn glasses ever since I'm a child, I wear them full time. So it was suggested to my parents that perhaps learning a musical instrument would help my vision. So I started taking piano lessons when I was six at a at a local school that was actually down the block. And I took to it really well. I didn't fight the lessons. I didn't fight practicing. And if you also look at the picture of me playing piano, you might notice quite a few statues of composers on top of the piano, and those were awards that I received for solo concerts between the age of maybe seven and nine. I still play the piano when I can, although I don't have one in my house right now. My brothers had a record player to play 33 RPM records which some people may or may not have seen, so there was a lot of music in the house, and so I listened to the stereo and then I started buying 45 RPM records and started playing those myself. According to my journals, I watched way too much television. The Ed Sullivan Show was interesting to me on Sunday nights because there tended to be diversified talent on that. Did a lot of writing. I think I started journaling maybe 10/12, something like that. And I actually have quite a few of my journals with me from seventh and eighth grade forward. Did a lot of writing in school. Other interests: It's hard for me to believe that I was as athletic as I was at the time. I played baseball and tennis and badminton. In Lincolnwood we had a billiards table set up in the family room, and I considered myself a pool shark at the time because I beat my brothers frequently. And so I liked the crack of the balls, listening to the balls hit each other and dropping into the pocket. We had a really nice table. We did badminton out in the yard and ping pong in the garage when cars were not in there. But I was pretty active in sports in grade school and particularly in high school. Well, I think we're still back in eighth grade, so I'll hold that for a few minutes. Lev Kalmens 20:34 You mentioned that you went to Niles West, right? Felicia Sue Kaplan 20:37 Yes, I did. Lev Kalmens 20:39 What are your memories of your time as a student in Niles West? Felicia Sue Kaplan 20:45 Well, as I mentioned, the suburbs were quite challenging for me. And I was very pleased with the friendships that I had developed in seventh and eighth grade. I spent a lot of time in Hebrew school and eventually had my Bas Mitzvah, and I have a lot of photographs of friends that attended my Bas Mitzvah. However, the transition from eighth grade to Niles West was another rocky one for me because all of the friendships that I had developed, none of those kids were in any of my classes in the four years. It was like I was starting over again. I never saw any of my friends. They weren't in my homeroom. They weren't in my classes. The school was considerably larger than Lincoln Hall. There was 3000 students at Niles West at the time. Do you recall how many were there when you were there, Lev? Lev Kalmens 22:15 I want to say approximately, I think my graduating-- Felicia Sue Kaplan 22:18 [overlapping] Lev went to Niles West too. Lev Kalmens 22:21 I think my graduating class had roughly 600, so times four. Between 600 and 650. So multiply that times four. So was it 2400? Felicia Sue Kaplan 22:36 Well, I distinctly remember 3000 kids running around. And I started out in many honors classes, so I became the ambitious diligent student and did okay. But by my junior year, I was like really stressed out again. And my health declined quite a bit. I was sick frequently. I walked around with a box of Kleenex all the time. I missed a lot of school. I had walking pneumonia for a while. I had mono, I had pneumonia--a lot of respiratory stuff. So I missed a lot of time at Niles West, which actually was okay with me but not so good for my education. So being that I had missed three months continuously in my junior year, it was very difficult to come back. I was able to get through my junior year. Had a fun summer. And then senior year, I came back for two weeks. And I just couldn't do it anymore. It just was too hard. Too much. Too many kids, just everything was just overwhelming. So I came home one day and announced that I quit High School. And it was one of the first times in my life that my parents actually listened and took me seriously and realized that I wasn't joking, that I just couldn't do it anymore. So they started looking for a private school for me. And I didn't know this until fairly recently, actually, that when we moved out of Chicago and were going to Lincolnwood, it was suggested--highly recommended--that Felicia go to a private school at that time. My parents did not listen at the time and never pursued that. So I struggled and struggled, and there I was 15/16 years old and flunking out of high school and very distraught and embarrassed and overwhelmed. Okay, so anyway, they finally found a private school for me here in Chicago. We were still living in Lincolnwood. Another thing that was problematic is that both of my brothers were out of the house already. My older brother Ed got married when he was 22. And Mark was away at college. So it was just me and the parents. And we didn't have a whole lot to talk about. But anyway, they did find me a private school. Latin School and Francis Parker would not accept me because my grades had gone down so much and they didn't want that kind of representation in their schools in Lincoln Park or the Gold Coast. So we found another school, or I think a relative suggested another private school called Bateman, which was in the Gold Coast and it was at the intersection of Burton Place and Aster. What happened is they took a very old, very large--here I go with another house. It was a McCormick mansion. And the Craig family purchased the property and converted it into a private school. And to give you an idea how different it was from Niles West: instead of 3000 students, there was 300 students from kindergarten through 12th grade. Lev Kalmens 27:33 This is across the street from Walter Payton now? Felicia Sue Kaplan 27:37 No. Lev Kalmens 27:37 No? Felicia Sue Kaplan 27:38 There's another Bateman private school. Lev Kalmens 27:41 Because I'm thinking of when describing the mansion, I for some reason ... Felicia Sue Kaplan 27:45 No, no, it's a very residential, very ritzy, fancy area. So, praise God, I was able to graduate from high school. And instead of 700 people in our graduating class, there was 25. And I made it through. I graduated high school. I have my eighth grade diploma. I have my Hebrew school diploma. I have my Hebrew high school diploma, pictures from my Bas Mitzvah. My diploma from Bateman. I graduated from high school, didn't really want to go to college, but I did do some of that afterwards. So Bateman was kind of a saving grace for me because a lot of the kids there had various problems going on, and I just made a whole lot of new friends and we had recess in the park. One of the Cardinals had a very large home around the block, and I knocked on the door one day and I asked if they could show me around. I thought that was kind of cute. And they very politely said no, so I went back to gym class. The school was a bit of a playground, to be honest. I spent a lot more time out of the school than in the classroom. But, I graduated high school, and the teachers didn't care about who you were, where you came from. The administration didn't care about your grades. If you had the money for tuition that was pretty much all they focused on, which was good for me. So I stayed in contact with a lot of the kids from Bateman for many years afterwards. Still living in Lincolnwood. My dad's business was fairly close to Bateman, so he would drop me off in the morning and then I would walk over to his factory after school, and he would take me back home. Sometimes I got a ride, or sometimes I took public. But yeah, Bateman was a lot of fun. And I was also fortunate to have some very caring, sensitive teachers. One in particular, her name is Beth Jaffe. And I had her for English and writing. And I didn't know until fairly recently it was the first class that she ever taught right out of school. She was quite young herself and a very good teacher. So she thought I had a lot of potential as a writer. And I probably still have some of the papers that I did in her class. I have a lovely inscription from her in my autograph album. And many of my other teachers at Bateman were very caring, very helpful, almost like special education teachers. And at Bateman, they also let me do some student teaching. I worked with the kindergarten class when I could and third grade and fifth grade, sometimes after school, sometimes during. I was more like an assistant to the teacher, but the kindergarteners I had all to myself, and that was a lot of fun. I always enjoyed those little ones. And put together a talent show when we were at Bateman. I remember auditioning some of my classmates in the library to see what they could do. And we put together a show. I was in the choir at Bateman. I also was in the choir at Niles West. And hopefully by the time you you hear this tape, you'll be able to look at the record albums that we made, that we cut and produced under the tutelage of Mr. Magee. So we made two record albums from festivals. Lev said that he might be able to put some of the songs for you to hear. Lev Kalmens 33:18 Yeah, we should be able to do that. Felicia Sue Kaplan 33:20 Yeah, that sounds like fun. Back at Niles West, I believe I auditioned for many of the plays and the festivals and the events, and never got the part. So I was in a couple of different clubs: Future Teachers of America and Adult Education--I think I helped in that office. We also did a magazine at Niles West called Apotheosis, and I have a couple copies of that for you to view, to look at. None of my stories are in there, but many of my classmates' are. So I guess Bateman was a lot more enjoyable and memorable than Niles West. But we did have an eighth grade reunion and a high school reunion many years later, and I have some memorabilia from that show and tell. Lev Kalmens 34:41 After you graduated high school, you said you went to college, and where did life take you after that? Felicia Sue Kaplan 34:52 Still living in Lincolnwood, not really wanting to go to college after so much trauma in high school, I took a couple classes at Columbia College in Chicago. It was kind of unique at that time--this was like 1969. The school rented a couple of floors in an old office building on Lakeshore Drive. And the ratio of boys to girls was 10 to one. So I was terrified, but I also was very excited because those numbers were good, and I got to meet a lot of people. So I studied creative writing. One of my favorite teachers, Dan Michalski, helped me do some really good writing in that class. I took a poetry class, and eventually started up a poetry group in the 80s in Chicago, which I ran for seven years. And so did some good stuff with our writing. So I dabbled a little bit at Columbia. And while I was going to Columbia, I worked part time. I used to walk Downtown after school, and I worked part time in the toy department of Wieboldt on State Street, which was an absolutely perfect fit for someone like me, with all these toys, and puzzles, and stuffed animals, and dolls, and games, and things that made noise, and things that moved. It was the biggest toy department I've ever been in. And it was a lot of fun. And then I think I worked in a diploma factory in Desplaines, or something. So I was typically combining school with starting to work part time. Education-wise, I changed my major maybe three or four times After Columbia, I studied voice and piano at Roosevelt University, Downtown. The commute got to be too difficult. And then, my dad had two businesses going at the time, and one of them was making custom upholstered furniture. So he helped me get a job with an interior designer in Chicago. And I thought: Oh, this is great; I'll work for her part time, and I'll go to design school part time. So I transferred to Harrington Institute of Interior Design, which was in the Fine Arts Building on Michigan Avenue at the time. A it was really, really hard. I worked for Jane Derek by day, and I went to Harrington maybe two nights a week. So they condensed the day school into six or eight hours of classroom in the evening. It was very intense. A lot of homework, did a lot of cool projects there. Oh, I just remembered I have some show and tell from design school, Lev. I'm holding out on you here. I have some drawings and floor plans and projects. Oh my God, that's in another binder. Felicia Sue Kaplan 39:20 So then I met a man when I was in my early 20s. Alan. And he was working as a transit planning engineer for the Chicago Transit Authority, for the CTA in Chicago, and he wanted to change jobs. He was offered some wonderful positions in a couple of major cities. He asked me to pick one, and I chose Atlanta, Georgia, and so I transferred design schools to the Art Institute of Atlanta. They didn't have subways or the L or anything in Atlanta in the early 70s, and so he was, again, helping with the bus routes there. And for the first time in my life, I had roommates. It really wasn't a problem. I'm kind of surprised, considering that I never shared my space with anybody but my family. And all of a sudden, I had three female roommates in a fairly small apartment. But I liked Atlanta a lot. There's a lot of things I liked about the city, and I was going to school full time. It was a lot more manageable. And I did some great work there. And so you're wondering, well, did I become a well-paid, famous interior designer? No, I didn't. I eventually moved back to Chicago, and back in Lincolnwood with the parents. And I got a wonderful job at Marshall Field's, that was on the fifth floor of Water Tower Place. Loved the job, made no money. But I loved what I was doing. I eventually managed the china and crystal department there. And they let me do displays. And I had some very wealthy clients that I worked with really closely, and had some very exciting experience with customers there. Some pretty famous people actually. So that was a good time. Lev Kalmens 42:26 What have you been doing? What takes up your time today? Felicia Sue Kaplan 42:36 It's pretty interesting to be in the Lincolnwood Library at this time and reminiscing about my life growing up here. Particularly because when I went to school down the block, as I mentioned earlier, to Rutledge and Lincoln Hall, this library was not here at the time, right? What year did you open here? Lev Kalmens 43:05 '78. Felicia Sue Kaplan 43:06 Okay. So this library didn't exist for a long time. And when I was at Niles West, we had a pretty handsome library there. But I remember--sorry--spending a lot of time at Skokie Library to do research and writing and sorting and things like that. And I became very fond of the Skokie Library, spent a lot of time there. So it's really exciting now, especially since the Lincolnwood Library has remodeled and it's very modern in here. If you haven't been in here in a long time, you really must. So several months ago, I was in this library for a storytelling workshop. And I noticed the flyers called "My Story." And I was with a friend in the storytelling workshop, who currently lives in Lincolnwood, and she says, "Oh, no, that's not for me." And I says, "Wait a second." I said, "I lived in Lincolnwood once upon a time. Let me tell my stuff." And speaking of stuff, I realized I had an awful lot of memorabilia and ephemera and photos, and Lev will tell you I got a lot of stuff to show and tell here, and I'm very happy to show it. So speaking of stories, I do share them around town from time to time. And I'm writing children's stories for little ones, usually age five to about age 10 or 11. And while I'm waiting for my checks from the magazine, I do homeschooling for the same group of children, kindergarten through four. And I decided, since I had some difficult times in education that I had a passion for working with children. Some who have gone or are in a public school and just need some extra help Some who are being totally homeschooled by their parents. Sometimes the parents are not a good fit to teach their own children, sometimes they travel too much. So then that's where I come in and work with kids either on one subject or multiple subjects. It's kind of a custom-made, tailored program for the children, depending upon what they they need. And of course, I have lots of show and tell for them in my dwelling, or I take it on the road. I really love teaching. I love telling stories and helping a child get through a tough time. I typically teach one-to-one, sometimes I have a small group. Whatever it is that they need, we work it out. Lev Kalmens 46:55 It sounds like you're giving back after having some difficult times yourself, growing up in education. Felicia Sue Kaplan 47:06 [overlapping] I'm trying. Felicia Sue Kaplan 47:06 I worked with a little girl at Niles Library last year. Her parents asked me to help her with her reading. Without divulging too much about the family or the child or myself, I think it turned out to be that she was a very active, athletic child and just didn't want to sit still long enough to hold a book and sit in her room and read. But I discovered that she was fine reading the same books online because she could move her arms and legs up and down. She could move around. She could put pause on the computer and come back. She didn't have to hold anything. She would just take her eyes on and off the screen. And it worked so much better for her. And she could take a break and do cartwheels or flips or something in the room that we were working in. If I saw that she was getting tired, I would take her through the library and introduce her to some more staff or some other kids and show her what she could do when she got a little bit older. I identified her strengths and her weaknesses. I mean, I don't think she really had a problem reading. She just didn't want to sit and do it. So I found something that she could incorporate her body and her eyes at the same time. And it seemed to work rather well. Her little brother was a student there also but somebody else worked with him. Really, really lovely family. Lev Kalmens 47:16 And the type of work sounds like it's fulfilling for you. Felicia Sue Kaplan 49:25 Yeah, as a teacher, when you can see that a child understands, when they get it. I did all sorts of extra fun projects with this little girl. During the time that we were working together, the family went to Poland for a week or two. So when she came back, I asked her if she had written a journal or taken notes or anything on her trip. And she didn't really know what a diary was. And I says, "Well, how about if you write a book? How about if you write a short book about your travels in Poland?" And she said, "What?" And so we sat down with a stack of construction paper and cut it to the right size. And she did the drawings and the writing of "My Week in Poland," and then she put her name on there, and I think her parents were mighty surprised. Lev Kalmens 50:43 Is there anything else that you want to sum up about your experience living in Lincolnwood? Felicia Sue Kaplan 50:51 In my late 20s--I think I was 27/28--I met somebody that had a sublet apartment available in Evanston. And I grabbed it. And so I didn't have a whole lot of things to put in it. But people pitched in, and I eventually set up. It was a very large studio apartment at almost the corner of Main and Ridge in Evanson, with a great view. And got situated there and started volunteering in a lot of neighborhood organizations in Evanston. It was a good first apartment for me. And I was in walking distance to the Jewel and started discovering all these foods that I didn't know existed. I grew up with a salad being iceberg lettuce, sliced cucumbers, and tomatoes. That was about it. And all of a sudden, I discovered all these different kinds of lettuce and all these cool vegetables and different things you could put on top of the salad, in the salad, make your own dressings. And I joined an ethnic dinner club and started trying all sorts of different cuisines. There's only 11,000 restaurants in Chicago at the present time. And one by one, I started checking them out. My parents were not particularly explorational, and I think that I went to the other spectrum and I wanted to try everything and do everything. So I'm very experimental, big explorer, and I was out there checking out these things. And then, eventually got more situated in the job market. I had a terrific job at Channel 11 WTTW, wonderful place to work. Unfortunately, I had three bosses at the same time, who really didn't want to share me equitably. They all were involved in different aspects of fundraising, which they all did really well. And once again, I was overworked and underpaid. At least I was out of the house, away from the parents. In my own place, I was starting to entertain and have parties. Had a bridal shower for my cousin. So life went forward. Lev Kalmens 54:35 Well, I'm excited to share a lot of the stuff that you brought on our website to show folks and to kind of put some of the things in context. And I do want to thank you for coming to the Lincolnwood Library and sharing your Lincolnwood story with us. Felicia Sue Kaplan 54:53 Well, thank you so much, Lev, for dreaming up this project in the first place. And it gives little chatterboxes like myself a forum to kvetch and share and hopefully convey that, finally, things are much brighter than they were when I was a teenager. And I drive past the house in Lincolnwood from time to time and was rather shocked to see a Christmas tree in the window last year when there never was before, and they've done some great updating and remodeling to the exterior. I've pondered ringing their doorbell and introducing myself just to see how things look. Now, I haven't quite gotten up the courage, but I certainly have a lot of cool photographs to show them. Lev Kalmens 55:59 And we'll share some of those with our audience. Once again, thank you so much. https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/5a6879d1a78d0e9dfd5cb09646013404.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=A-uE1ySQm8AM6DtCfNjQ5b5Tg6pjlWEIS077ttVRd3BdzcTVKZcQbrvS%7EVvC3dyXs1Urwp55u7Ru3G4Q-CYbVgOr48JGVY016v9aGtwcs9tXXsw-0dm1oGx63sKzbEhUUkHcC4FbkjE7SzfcrTtlCwVFvv81rZROvEGqEdXZoS0pSUb4uZn4fEcAh8voJTQl-Q1m069wBU1jA7Zd4TaA%7EvUh-wvNccZeLxwvObGXg-t%7EdsOnEIKScG1leUSIQO10vn2H8DEq13bDywOTbEYViwZ6R%7EPH2vL1qFeewM84x7P3zA%7EYZ0O4abzOO9YcZNETrsquKQUnr8RWy3KxrOf6Dg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM c7f681dd065801e678c595cb8a8409af Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Frank Chulay, June 2019 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/6332792535d8e0c91c480afeed3e1a0f.mp3?Expires=1781740800&Signature=ZugKJ9tKlax0K41dsfYZfc2%7EkP39B4aBJtdWaJwkb3gfmXondcTP5LDgAKk33Go0%7E69pY-7j-tgrgFDdIaToF-Ci8uh0FHxqVJ6oXEdLIC19s%7EcniTClsWi6UzMMrqVjjxWegKeCOssAy0vwMEY6m-oMl6rkXXb9PSOfWb-ylYhbKIxnswI07FjqH4rgdu6-SyP-6urWHK4fmq4oZCT670yVEq1lK5jImIU2w-iBHgJLLngQd%7ECDH6hb%7EG2L%7EPrb8ZzWiNEulJJtDTwXEtNixrE4w6JjF8qbvYd97FxHDT6tIm5iFDcD0bygsdw0iq0gkD1l8bhY6tE-soOVVcQFFg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 824fd853e931c6503c638b44c2506294 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Frank Chulay Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Frank Chulay Subject The topic of the resource “Lincolnwood has always been a pleasant place for us. I was proud to be mayor.” Frank Chulay was mayor of Lincolnwood from 1985-1993. Originally from Hungary, Mr. Chulay immigrated to the United States in 1923. He talks about his career, his time as mayor, and serving as a pilot in World War II. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Lev Kalmens 0:00 My name is Lev Kalmens. I'm an Information Services Librarian here at the Lincolnwood Public Library. And today I am speaking with Frank Chulay for My Lincolnwood Story. Frank, thank you for being here. And what is your lincolnwood story? Frank Chulay 0:16 Well, I'm a resident for 52 years. And I worked for a company for 35 years. And they gave me early retirement. But I wasn't happy to early retire. They said, "Well, the food deposit--Chicago Food Depository--is looking for someone." And I took the job there and worked for them. And then all of a sudden, they were going to make me the director of the food depository. But in the meantime, the Lincolnwood mayor that was also retiring asked me to run for his seat. And I wasn't sure. I was never in politics. But I decided I would run for it. So during the election time, people were against a mall. And that came up after I was elected. I won and became mayor. And we, the board, and with my approval, authorized the mall to be built. Now the other big thing that happened about two weeks after I was made Mayor, I got a nice letter from the Chicago Fire Chief, saying, "Congratulations on your election. As of a month from now, we will no longer do the fire service in Lincolnwood. We have a first aid unit. But we did not have a fire department. We had a police department, but not a fire department. So I got all upset about it. And I talked to the state representative in our district. And he said, "Let's go talk to Mayor Washington." So we went to City Hall, talked to Mayor Washington, and he was very kind, but he didn't think he could do it. So we had to develop a fire department for the city. And I went to the people that were going to build the mall. And I got a million dollars from them to build a new city hall and a fire department. Lev Kalmens 3:21 Well, before we go on, so you said you've been in Lincolnwood for 52 years. So that's what, 1967. How did you end up in Lincolnwood? I kind of want to know where you were born, how your family ended up in Lincolnwood? Frank Chulay 3:37 Oh, well, number one, I was born in Hungary. Lev Kalmens 3:42 Okay. Frank Chulay 3:42 But I came to the United States when I was two years old. Lev Kalmens 3:46 Okay. Frank Chulay 3:46 I grew up in a town in Chicago called Jefferson Park. Lev Kalmens 3:53 Sure. Frank Chulay 3:54 And when I was still there, I graduated from Prussing Grade School. From Schurz High School. And then I went to Chicago Teachers College. And that's where I was when the war came along, and I had to sign up for the draft. Lev Kalmens 4:19 So do you mind my asking what year did you come to the United States? Frank Chulay 4:25 1923. I was born 1921. Lev Kalmens 4:30 Okay, so that makes you 97? Frank Chulay 4:33 97. I'll be 98 this year. Lev Kalmens 4:35 Wow. That's quite impressive, I must say. So what do you remember about growing up in Jefferson Park at that time? Frank Chulay 4:43 Oh, it was a lovely neighborhood. I remember a lot of things from Prussing. It was a grad school. I was a police boy, and one year, I was the head of the police boys. And one of my classmates is still living. He lives in California. That was great growing up. Lev Kalmens 5:20 What prompted you to move to Lincolnwood? Frank Chulay 5:23 And then when we got married, right after the war, it was so difficult to find a place to live. So we ended up in Rogers Park. And then we bought a place in Sauganash Park. That was on the other side of Devon. So then, we were enticed with Lincolnwood. And we move to Lincolnwood. Lev Kalmens 5:59 So did you serve in the war? Frank Chulay 6:01 Oh, yes, I was a pilot in World War II. I tell my friends I've been to Hawaii twice: once on my way to Okinawa, once on my way back. And I served in South Pacific and ended up in Okinawa, when the war was ended there. Lev Kalmens 6:32 So when you move back-- Frank Chulay 6:34 And I came back to Chicago, and we've had trouble finding a place, but we bought a home in Sauganash Park. 60-something Trip Avenue. Lev Kalmens 6:53 What was this area like back then? Frank Chulay 6:59 Sauganash was rich people, and Lincolnwood had a section that was the Towers in Lincolnwood. Lev Kalmens 7:09 Right, right. Frank Chulay 7:11 And we always would go through the Towers at Christmas time to see all the decorations. Lev Kalmens 7:20 Yeah, I think they still have it now, that house where the Christmas tree goes all the way through all the levels of the home. Frank Chulay 7:27 Right. Yeah. Lev Kalmens 7:30 So you moved to Lincolnwood in 1967. Then you moved to Sauganash--was it in the early '50s, late '40s? Frank Chulay 7:39 '67. We came to Lincolnwood in '67. Lev Kalmens 7:42 Right, but what about Sauganash Park? Frank Chulay 7:45 Oh, we were there for a good number of years. Lev Kalmens 7:50 Okay, so you said right after the war, right? Yeah. So in the late '40s. Frank Chulay 7:54 Yeah. Lev Kalmens 7:54 Okay. So what was the company that you were working for at that time? Frank Chulay 7:59 That was Signal Steel Strapping Company, and they were at Western and Logan Boulevard. Lev Kalmens 8:10 Okay. And what did you do there? Frank Chulay 8:13 I was an accountant. Lev Kalmens 8:16 What was your educational background in? Your education, what did you go to school for? Frank Chulay 8:25 After I graduated from Schurz, my dad couldn't afford to send me to the University of Illinois in Champaign. So I spent two years at Wright Junior College. And then I was working at the Palace Theater, Downtown. And one of my teammates there says, "Why don't you take the exam for Chicago Teachers College?" So I took the exam and passed, and I started at Chicago Teachers College. And then the war came along, and I had to go in to serve. And when I got out of service, Uncle Sam sent me to DePaul. Lev Kalmens 9:19 DePaul. Frank Chulay 9:21 So I graduated from DePaul with a degree. Lev Kalmens 9:26 Okay. Frank Chulay 9:27 In accounting. Lev Kalmens 9:28 Okay, so that's-- Frank Chulay 9:29 And that's when I got my job with Signal Steel Strapping Company, and I was with them. Lev Kalmens 9:37 Your entire career? Or your entire career in accounting. And then you said you retired, or your early retirement was-- Frank Chulay 9:45 In about '84--'83 or '84. And I became mayor in '85. '85 to '93. Lev Kalmens 9:59 Why did you think that that was something you were interested in doing, becoming mayor, since you had no political experience. Frank Chulay 10:07 [overlapping] Well, what prompted me was the current mayor didn't want to run you for another year. And he lived a couple of houses from me. And he said, "Why don't you go for mayor?" I said, "I was never in politics." But it sounded good. And either I would be mayor, or I'd be director of the Greater Chicago Food Depository. So I took mayor. Lev Kalmens 10:39 Tell me about it. What were some of the challenges? What did you like about it? What were the accomplishments? Frank Chulay 10:47 Yeah. At that time, there were people who were against the mall--some people, not everybody. Lev Kalmens 10:56 Oh, you're talking about Lincolnwood Town Center? Frank Chulay 10:59 Yeah, Laincolnwood Town Center. Lev Kalmens 11:01 Okay. Frank Chulay 11:02 And I went to them, and they gave me the million dollars for that, but I authorized the mall. And then we built the new village hall, fire department, police department, and everything else we needed. Except the building for public's works were no longer in the back with us. We have a new section for them. Lev Kalmens 11:44 So you're talking about the building that's now here in Lincolnwood, kind of by Proesel Park. By Proesel Park where that village hall is? Frank Chulay 11:54 Yeah. Lev Kalmens 11:56 So where was the facility before? Or where was City Hall before? Frank Chulay 12:04 Oh, City Hall was in the same spot as we built it. Only, at that time, it was on the street behind Lincoln. Lev Kalmens 12:23 Okay. Frank Chulay 12:24 So it's by the parks. The parks district. We own that property. Yeah, in fact the police department was in back of City Hall. But the new building was on Lincoln Avenue rather than the street behind it. Lev Kalmens 12:59 Gotcha. I understand now, okay. I didn't know that. I didn't know that that's where it used to be. Okay, so you rebuilt City Hall. You added the police department and the fire department. And then during your time, Lincolnwood Town Center was built. What was on the property where Lincolnwood Town Center is now? What was there prior to that? Frank Chulay 13:22 I can't think of the name of the place. It was at one time, they made the telephones and stuff. Lev Kalmens 13:36 Well, are you talking about Bell & Howell? Frank Chulay 13:39 Bell & Howell! That the one. Lev Kalmens 13:42 Because I know that Bell & Howell was on the other side, on Pratt, where Lincolnwood Place and Lincolnwood [inaudible] are now. Frank Chulay 13:50 Yes. They had a good portion of that area. Lev Kalmens 13:54 Okay. Frank Chulay 13:56 The Town Center bought everything else they needed. Lev Kalmens 14:00 So how was it decided that the village needed a big mall? Frank Chulay 14:05 Well, they were deciding that they wanted to build a mall there. And the people that lived near that, they didn't want it. But it was a good thing. We put it in because financially it helped the village. Lev Kalmens 14:25 Because Lincolnwood doesn't really have a downtown area. Frank Chulay 14:29 No. That's right. Lev Kalmens 14:30 So was the mall kind of the closest you could come to that? Frank Chulay 14:36 That's right. We had at that time the hotel. Lev Kalmens 14:43 The Purple Hotel. Frank Chulay 14:44 Purple Hotel, right. But other than that, there wasn't really a downtown. Yeah. Lev Kalmens 14:51 What were some of the hardest parts, or what was the hardest thing about being village mayor? Frank Chulay 14:58 There were times when you had to make decisions. You didn't know which way to go, and then you had to do something. And those were the times. And when you had to give speeches. Lev Kalmens 15:17 After your tenure as mayor--what would you call it--your time as mayor was over? What did you do? You said you were mayor till '93? Frank Chulay 15:25 Well, after I was mayor--I mean, just before my job ended--my first wife died. And then the young lady that was in a club that we belonged to, we kind of, after a couple years, we kind of go in together. And it was 23 years ago. And then I got remarried. At 98 I'm still here. Lev Kalmens 16:05 That's amazing. Mrs. Chulay 16:08 Yeah, I'm happy to. And I'm not 98. Lev Kalmens 16:13 I won't ask you how to old you are. In the time that you've lived here in Lincolnwood--not just your time as mayor--since the late '60s, how has the village evolved in your opinion? Frank Chulay 16:28 I think that the village got more modern here than it was here years ago. Lev Kalmens 16:36 In what kind of ways? Frank Chulay 16:37 Well in people are more active. And there are more things going on. We started with a Lincolnwood Fest, and things like that make it so much nicer. Yeah. Lev Kalmens 16:55 So you're saying just more community involvement from the residents? Frank Chulay 17:00 I think so, yeah. Lev Kalmens 17:02 So what do you do now to keep yourself active? To entertain? Frank Chulay 17:11 As we get older, we're very fortunate. My daughter-in-law makes a bunch of meals, different meals, and she freezes them. And then she sends them up here from North Carolina, and we put them in our freezer. And because of that, we're able to live in our apartment, and feed ourselves or get outside things once in a while. Fortunately, I can still drive a car. I flew an airplane. Right. And I just got my notice from Secretary of State that you have to renew your license every year. Lev Kalmens 18:07 What do you think has contributed to your just staying so active through the years? Frank Chulay 18:12 Well, I don't know. I think it's that being active. For quite a while, I was going to the Skokie YMCA, but then they shut the pool down for a while. And I dropped out. And now I'm getting a little bit older. So I think that I have to be active in order to stay going. I get more tired now than I used to. Mrs. Chulay 18:55 We go to Florida for four months. Lev Kalmens 18:57 Okay. Yeah, that certainly helps. Frank Chulay 18:59 That's the other thing. Lev Kalmens 19:00 Yeah. Frank Chulay 19:01 Going to Florida every year for during the winter. Lev Kalmens 19:05 Oh yeah. You don't want to be here during that time. Frank Chulay 19:06 And another thing is that we have more friends and companions down there than we do here. So much of our friends are deceased.Yeah. Lev Kalmens 19:25 What would you say that you've been most proud of in your life? Frank Chulay 19:32 The what? Lev Kalmens 19:33 The most proud of? Frank Chulay 19:34 Proud of? Lev Kalmens 19:35 Proud of. Yeah. Frank Chulay 19:41 Yeah, I guess flying was most because I don't believe it either that I was a pilot. Yeah, you know, it's been a long time. And I say, "Did I really fly that thing?" Especially when I get onto a plane. They had a show here with the B-24s. And we got into it, they had that you could go into it and walk around. And I got into it, and then I said, "This thing is so small. When I got into it, it was big." Lev Kalmens 20:27 Was that the type of plane that you flew? Frank Chulay 20:29 Yeah. Lev Kalmens 20:29 Do you have any regrets? Frank Chulay 20:30 No, I have no regrets because I've been all over the world, either as by myself or during the war. Lev Kalmens 20:48 So you've traveled a lot. Frank Chulay 20:49 I've traveled a lot. Lev Kalmens 20:52 What has been the most memorable place that you've traveled to? Frank Chulay 20:57 Well, I think that my trip over to the South Pacific. I always remember that. The Philippines, we were there quite a bit. Lev Kalmens 21:11 How long were you there for? Frank Chulay 21:14 How long in The Philippines? Or all together? Lev Kalmens 21:18 All together. Frank Chulay 21:19 Well, I think I joined in about '43 to '46. Three years. Lev Kalmens 21:26 Is there anything else that you would like to mention/talk about from your time living here in Lincolnwood or anything else at all? Frank Chulay 21:36 Well, Lincolnwood has always been a pleasant place for us. And I was proud to be mayor. One thing I remember about the Army Air Corps is that when the war came along, and we had to sign up for the draft, I signed up for the draft. And then somewhere--I don't remember this, whether it was at school or what--they said, "If you sign up for the Army Air Corps, you can finish school." Now, that's wonderful. So I signed up for the Army Air Corps. And three weeks later, I was called out and I was sent to Miami Beach. And there, they decided what I would be. They had us come in to a place where there were three officers at the desk. And they called you up. And they said, "What do you want to be: a pilot, a navigator, or a bombadier?" And I said, "I think I'll be a pilot." "You think you'll be a pilot?! If you want to be a pilot, you'll..." "Sir. I want to be a pilot." "Get out of here." I went out. I was called back, and, "Now, what do you want to be: pilot, navigator, or bombadier?" "I think, what did I do the best in?" "Oh, you were good at all three." "Then I'll take pilot." "Then you'll take pilot?! Get out of here." Well, the third time, I learned. I walked up and said, "Sir, I want to be a pilot." And how it happened, I don't know. Lev Kalmens 23:43 So just like that, it was completely your choice. Frank Chulay 23:47 Yeah. Lev Kalmens 23:48 Well, I want to thank you so much for coming down, for sharing your lincolnwood story with us. Frank Chulay 23:55 You'll be able to get something out this. Lev Kalmens 23:58 It was a lovely conversation. Thank you so much. https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/6db6d757e10a11c00613b732a656c00e.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=Tyt36pbRcKEDMFXjIumJb5NPvYqxh7L1ICnUYCZ66r2DlU2GBcxr4OGEgscYHETf6g5XV-Flpl2ANPwGKf3aPqy1mcVt2CDg4F6DpLcG%7EqSYj1SIsjXo74S4f-4Q5tVRfWVhRTfSXk9-YaRJWWopJmNpEvXUuEQctMDFDETAS1QI2QfBnIFNJL6GnrYA099DrNLCXZdqlu5EZOXq2RS-M0ayj5pN0KOEoq8Q4ujHCS%7EfziNs1QGy5PqUPRJNkRfPuE3XlyZqZ4cfpZMOyWDOATkI44tEnvXaxXov9BN8-9ly80OIYPlbPRXmBqonchDgidZz6eeat0IAwDjwvAXOPg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM d52f9acae901336780916c7b991b7260 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Jerry Schenwar, May 2019 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/8074c5b75cda0ee5150ea3d2f3bc4522.mp3?Expires=1781740800&Signature=FHTfmHjYKqd86h9l99OL2FCjMzovtRnClGhV9XafUKn1YQUTep3rad6B3etFEDpFPyVPYSnWT0Ujd2ZGi0eWQklwEoC9AqerI7X6CwXpRB1xSMEqAKgJbe2vLCRxwnFjSjvPhwaQZZuDXGyRTqdCanonPutwQC31DYtYREhBgOnt0y8HsVg1qDMoWoIFs4FK2Pq7gl-a5Wb6qXPWhrqJWcwA1Y-5DIj4rTWjsK0fprV-dTl9hk0-VLtmANDBQ%7Ebj1LITbrqx3TYDeRbXSQpSN4boeVOxe29fv01wQBU9sfmlFJPUCEqXzZdHd%7EZDEsKi2Ca0WBc2Mn3XuzUBnVnk6A__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM ff71fc292ce52ec17d330d6e5cb50f39 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Jerry Schenwar https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/d76007586591385f371cd0f6e68fc3a8.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=LU7E5odlrzq5J8wxAEKif0JpatpuI17Md%7E2WvRHhapVkJ7JEFH8N36XnaK-105pVWTfiTIJFKqkI9BEE9p7JCCIu6AcSVzwxLTD5fNZQBh0bDZIOh2yNBC9mTJBSe3kaqbINX732ELFaPGIKUkHzuoXCfPUL0pxcHQIisI7tIsxUkc9%7ELEoq3f5Sip6acIenkdvx9Td8Q5I0INqW7UXJ9P381IXT7TYv3YhRZ8Ad1Eo0Bj2cYdp5mq6xA2lNCd--gDTurDQqLgoO2QJ0mwVf4kZ1AhJXGEWSNg7zbF0Iwa42PjPEZ6kYee%7EyRtYz%7ED8LNgRKsAwmqLcf37smRAclIA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM a30a985c45ae51964dacde1a6981592e Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource The Milk Pail (Courtesy of consumergrouch.com) https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/d9caf3aa4a1025ac59ed2f7270d403ea.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=N5vtZ7259tsTkKgPkgcLhVWwn2E0Yi2tRgnFCwNsVJJN7pDlRhDyObCrbvwBRgwwjJppGeQxXfiWdFBG%7E4gymqoTS-m7RSbcYVm7Q19s0v4nmHqqKSP0TT7peo33d43Lv8Ld7ICDwuMzUn7uW4q4icHr-ZT%7EJwvXrdbG6uIWn0Ni7Y662Vs5ib1csrJXIfYWBbDYNrCtX3dAKchNshJiWm-3nuZR8fC03FmOylMqhcihl5lGw4LGUARQE5tgmLCqlX24FfxzIGqxh%7EuTTKTO7KP9a8RKv0O4g34RUrWirngHqY0Oqat3%7EhsNLIeoIVYJjaMJz5Gb5nDxC-WEaeUAWA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM aebdd43eca2d13b571dc70b9ed87bfdb Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource The Milk Pail (Courtesy of craigslostchicago.com) Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Jerry Schenwar Subject The topic of the resource “Compared to the sixties, Lincolnwood is a whole lot more diverse, and more interesting.” Jerry Schenwar has lived in Lincolnwood since 1989. Originally from Chicago, his first job was at the Milk Pail in Lincolnwood. Jerry remembers jobs from his teenage years, talks about his career as a high school teacher, and why he enjoys living in Lincolnwood today. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Lev Kalmens 0:00 My name is Lev Kalmens. Today is May 6th 2019, and I am interviewing Jerry Schenwar for My Lincolnwood Story. Jerry, thank you for being here. What is your Lincolnwood story? Jerry Schenwar 0:15 Well, I'm 74 years old, and I only moved to Lincolnwood in 1989. But my Lincolnwood story takes place 1962-63 when I was in high school. I lived by Devon and Kedzie, in Chicago. But Lincolnwood was a couple blocks away. I got a job in high school, working after school and on weekends, at the Milk Pail, which was about a block west of McCormick on Devon. It was a small supermarket, very popular, small supermarket that was there for many years. It was one of my first jobs, it was a big experience, for me. It was a great experience in high school. Just to describe the Milk Pail a little bit. It was a small supermarket, you'd say now, and at the back of the store there was a counter where the dairy products were and we, the clerks, would -- people would come up to the counter and ask for milk, or butter, or eggs, or sour cream, or half and half. And we would get it from the cooler for them right in back of us. Then we would ring up their order, it was all one counter and just had registers and [the register didn't specify] nothing about how much change we owe them, we would just take their bills -- no charge cards then, just money -- you take their money and count back from the price to what they gave us. And here's your change. We would put it in a bag for them, no plastic bags, just paper bags. The funny thing is, I still remember the prices. Even at the time the groceries were average prices. Oh -- also there was a produce counter at the front end of the store; by the street, by Devon. There was a produce guy who worked there, Byron, very funny guy. He would weigh the produce for the people, put in a bag, mark the price, and then they bring it back to us. The prices were very reasonable. It was a very popular store. A gallon of milk cost 79 cents. If you bought a gallon of milk, you'd get a pint of half and half for 23 cents. Only with a gallon of milk. Half a gallon was 42 cents a quart was 24 cents. Cigarettes, we sold them cigarettes, 25 cents a package for the regular -- you know, the non-filter, 28 cents for Marlboros and the filter cigarettes a carton was $2.41. I don't know, I just happen to remember these prices from way back and it sounds funny nowadays. Lev Kalmens 3:59 So customers didn't walk around picking up their own -- Jerry Schenwar 4:01 They did. They would pick up the produce, the fruit and vegetables. He [Byron] would weigh them and put them in a bag for them mark the price. But otherwise they would walk up and down the aisles with their shopping carts and it was self service. Then they would bring it to us in the back. Mostly guys, for some reason, worked there. There were a couple of women, older women. Lev Kalmens 4:34 How did you start working there? How did you find out that there was a job opening at the Milk Pail? Jerry Schenwar 4:40 That I don't remember. I was a junior in high school. In those days you just went around to stores in the neighborhood and asked them if they needed help. I worked at the Red Hot Ranch on Devon before that, that was slave labor. That was 60 cents an hour. Even then it was a terrible wage. Milk Pail was much better, it was a $1.50, or something. I worked at Thillens ballpark a little bit, but the Milk Pail was my best experience. When I started there I was as a kid, I was very nervous. It was new, it was hard for me at first. The manager who worked during the day -- I worked on the days and Saturday and Sunday -- was Louis Guskey. He was just a great guy, he took me under his wing and was like, "it's okay, kid I'll teach ya." I was kind of this, you know, sheltered, middle class Jewish guy. And the place was not a Jewish business. It was Art Blanch, by the time I knew him, he was a really old guy and he'd sit up in the office. It was just a very broadening experience for me just to learn about the world. I remember Art Blanch, the owner, said to me, "Kid, this is a penny business." In other words, you know, every penny was important. [The manager] Louis was a great guy. Saturday we would work three to twelve. Afterwards we would go out bowling sometimes. For a 16 year old kid that was big experience, you know, go out late at night, and it was okay. Lev Kalmens 7:06 What about it was mind opening for you? Jerry Schenwar 7:14 The guys I met there, the workers, were different. Kind of a different milieu that I was used to. They weren't Jewish, they were working class guys. It was very interesting for me, it was very broadening in that sense to get to see the greater world outside. It was it was very educational, I would say. Lev Kalmens 7:46 You said you grew up in West Rogers Park at Devon and Kenzie, right? Jerry Schenwar 7:49 Yeah. Yeah. Lev Kalmens 7:51 Where did you go to school? Jerry Schenwar 7:53 Mather. Lev Kalmens 7:54 Mather High School. Jerry Schenwar 7:57 I don't know if that's allowed because this is Lincolnwood. Can I talk about -- [laughs) Lev Kalmens 8:02 [overlapping] Of course. You live in Lincolnwood now, everything is fair game. Jerry Schenwar 8:09 Okay. The working in high school was a great experience for me because teenage years can be kind of hard and socially I wasn't too adapt. The jobs were great. It was fun working at the hotdog place at Thillens. There was a bigger supermarket called Hillmans in those days, by Devon and Western, I worked there one summer. Lev Kalmens 8:47 Tell me about what it was like on Devon Avenue back when you're growing up. I'm familiar with the area now but I'm curious to know what the neighborhood was like back in the 50s and 60s. Jerry Schenwar 9:03 Very quiet, middle class. Mostly Jewish, but not orthodox at all. Not orthodox, like it is now. Let's see. There was a Robert Hall, that was kind of a cheap clothing department store. Rosen's Drugs on Devon in Sacramento. Randal's Restaurant on Devon and California. Very thriving. Very thriving, lively place. Lev Kalmens 9:53 What was your experience like in Mather High School? Jerry Schenwar 9:58 Well Mather was a brand new school when I went there. It had just opened up in 1959, that's when I started high school. I was sort of new in the neighborhood. My family had moved from Albany Park. Like a lot of other kids at that time, I had moved from Albany Park up to Rogers Park Lev Kalmens 10:24 Why did they decide to move? Jerry Schenwar 10:32 I guess it was a nicer neighborhood, you'd say. So I moved out to Rogers Park when I was about 14. It was a different world, I was [really] into cars and in those days cars were -- it was just interesting because every year the new styles would come out, and there wew big changes. Now cars kind of look like each other more. Lev Kalmens 11:25 Right. Jerry Schenwar 11:26 They were very -- they had their own personalities. Lev Kalmens 11:29 Did you have a favorite? Favorites? Jerry Schenwar 11:32 Oh, yeah. Corvettes. [laughs] But we had a Studebaker Lark, which was a compact car. From the Studebaker Company. Lev Kalmens 11:43 What was your first car? Jerry Schenwar 11:45 That I owned myself? Lev Kalmens 11:47 Right. Yeah. Jerry Schenwar 11:47 1965 Ford Galaxy. So it's like a two door Ford. It's okay. Lev Kalmens 11:58 Was there a specific dream car that you wanted? Because in 1965 you were just out of high school, right? Jerry Schenwar 12:09 Well, like I say, you know, the Corvette, you know, there was the Thunderbird. Those were beautiful sports cars. Lev Kalmens 12:18 What did you do after graduating from high school? Jerry Schenwar 12:20 I went to college at the University of Illinois, Champaign. Lev Kalmens 12:26 What did you study there? Jerry Schenwar 12:29 I ended up majoring in history. Lev Kalmens 12:31 Okay. Jerry Schenwar 12:32 But later, I picked up education classes and I became a high school teacher in Chicago. High school Spanish then English teacher. Lev Kalmens 12:42 Where did you teach? Jerry Schenwar 12:43 I started on the south side; Tilden High School, Philip's High School for some years. In those days, you would get transferred, suddenly, for some reason, and I get transferred to Kelvyn Park High School, which is on the northwest side by Fullerton and Cicero. And I was there for 25 years. Lev Kalmens 13:07 So is that where you retired from? Jerry Schenwar 13:09 Yeah, I taught for 34 years. Lev Kalmens 13:17 Was that something you wanted to do growing up, was to go into education? Jerry Schenwar 13:21 No. Lev Kalmens 13:21 What was your dream job? Jerry Schenwar 13:24 For a long time, I wanted to be a lawyer. And then I thought I would be a judge. But also, when I was very young, they wanted me to umpire a baseball game. It was very unpleasant for me, my friend was tagged out at second base, and I called them safe. The other guy threatened to beat me up after the game. So I said, you know, I don't think I want to be a judge. Because my experience as an umpire wasn't good. For a long time I wanted to be a lawyer, and then that kind of faded away. I really didn't know what I wanted to do in my early 20s. Then I just sort of fell into teaching but ended up really loving the job, being a high school teacher, I tried to teach at grammar school, and that didn't work at all. So the older kids were better for me. Lev Kalmens 14:30 What's been the highlight of your career as a high school teacher? What made it worth it? Jerry Schenwar 14:41 The day to day. If I could connect with the students in a way; if I felt they were learning something and excited about learning. That was very satisfying to me. When you're standing up in front of a group of teenagers you can't really go to sleep; you got to be alert and time went fast. There were a lot of difficulties too. I was in an inner city school. So there were a lot of problems. But it gave me a direction in life because I grew up in the 60s, and there was a lot of uncertainty about things. So that was great. Lev Kalmens 15:38 So you said you moved to Lincolnwood in 1989? Jerry Schenwar 15:42 Yeah. Lev Kalmens 15:44 Tell me about that. Jerry Schenwar 15:55 We were living in Rogers Park, my wife, Clara, she had been a teacher, but at the time, she owned a bookstore, a children's bookstore on Touhy near California. So we were living in Rogers Park and [my daughter] was at Rogers School. The kindergarten class was very big and we weren't excited about the teacher at all. And Clara had this bookstore and this woman came in, Mrs. Naka, she and her husband lived in Lincolnwood for a long time, and still do. And Mrs. Naka, she was an aide, then she became a teacher in the Lincolnwood Schools. She came into the store a lot, bought a lot of books. She and Clara would talk and Clara was talking about the school Maya was going to and Linda said, "you know, the schools and Lincolnwood are good." So that's really why we moved to Lincolnwood. But the funny thing there, another Lincolnwood connection, her husband, Denny, and I went to grammar school together. And we knew each other. Just more recently, we become good friends.We go to Starbucks together up on Touhy. So it's kind of funny how things are -- what it was, six degrees of separation. Lev Kalmens 17:49 Right. Jerry Schenwar 17:50 But anyways, we moved to Lincolnwood for the schools. And it worked out. It was good for Maya. Our daughter Maya. Lev Kalmens 18:02 How old was she when you guys moved? Because she started in Chicago schools and then you immediately brought her here? Jerry Schenwar 18:10 Yeah, first grade, she went to first grade in Lincolnwood. Yeah. The first teacher wasn't great, but most of the teachers are very good. She got a good education. Lev Kalmens 18:23 So it sounds like Lincolnwood was your first experience living in the suburbs, having grown up in Chicago. Jerry Schenwar 18:36 Oh, yeah, yeah. I wasn't dying to living rooms but you know, Lincolnwood, it's great. Just because the location you know, you're so close to things. Lev Kalmens 18:49 Was there was there some was there a difficulty adjusting? And I know, like you said, we are very close to Chicago. Was there a difficulty adjusting to the suburban life versus the city life? Jerry Schenwar 19:01 Not really. Yeah, that that wasn't it. There are plenty other problems. But no, the neighbors were friendly. We felt welcome. Infact, back in the 90s, we had block parties every summer for a while. The selling point -- I didn't mention this -- the selling point is we live right next to O'Brien Park by Chase and East Prairie. So that was definitely a selling point. At that time we just had Maya. Later Keeley came along, our other daughter. The people that lived around O'Brien Park would come to this block party every summer. We had maybe five, six years. It was very nice. I've always liked it. I love, well I like the location because we're a block from the Touhy with Dunkin Donuts. Wholly Frijoles. Now Wholly Frijoles -- we went in there when they first opened, and it was very much smaller than it is now, it was just a little place. And we ate there and it was really good. And we were the only ones there. So we say jeez we hope this place survives! Because this is really good. We got to tell people about it. Then something happened that I think it got reviewed in the [Chicago Tribune] or something. And it just changed real fast. It caught on in a big way. And then you couldn't get a seat. Renga Tai is on the corner, the Japanese restaurant. So I like having that stuff close by. Especially Dunkin Donuts [laughter]. Lev Kalmens 21:18 It's a good place to have nearby. Jerry Schenwar 21:20 Oh, yeah. I mean now that I'm retired -- I've been retired for 12 years now -- just to go there in the morning, have my coffee, sit down, read or do a crossword puzzle. I like being in public spaces like that. So that's nice. I like that. Because the the other thing is, I like living next to the park because what I don't like about suburban living is the empty streets without any [unintelligible]. So when you got the park there, whenever the weather is nice there are people there, a lot of people. And the park is just nice. Lev Kalmens 22:05 So you said you've been retired for 12 years, what have you been doing with your time since then? Jerry Schenwar 22:10 Well, I had a couple of part time jobs. I was what they call teacher in the library in Chicago Libraries, where you come in like 3 to 6 and help kids with their homework. So I did that for several years. And I do some volunteer things for quite a few years at Gail's School, which is an East Rogers Park program where you help kids with their reading. You sit down and read with them. As I said Dunkin Donuts, and I like to explore the city, and just kind of have fun like that. Lev Kalmens 22:57 What are some life lessons you've learned over the years? Jerry Schenwar 23:01 Keep trying. Keep moving. Be kind. I like what the Dalai Lama said, "kindness is my religion". [laughs] Lev Kalmens 23:11 So you've lived in Lincolnwood for 30 years now what? What's different? What has changed? Jerry Schenwar 23:16 I don't notice. I could compare Lincolnwood in the 60s, the Lincolnwood that I knew just -- Lev Kalmens 23:25 From living down the street? Jerry Schenwar 23:26 Yeah. Oh, the other thing, just a couple of things about Lincolnwood. A colleague of mine at Kelvyn Park, Harold; he was older. He's about 10 years old than me, older Jewish guy who had grown up in Chicago. And he said he would come here in the 30s, -- it must have been in the 30s or 40s. And Lincolnwood was a network of sidewalks without any houses because I guess what happened is they laid out the village in the 20s then the depression hit and they weren't doing any construction. So yeah, he told me he would come out with his family for picnics and Lincolnwood was just this open place with all these sidewalks. If you look at the inscription on some of the sidewalks, it says Peter Lutch 2905 Farragut 1928. But the houses are not from 1928 they're, you know, from the 40s, 50s -- Lev Kalmens 24:58 Right. Jerry Schenwar 24:58 Right? Lev Kalmens 24:58 Yeah. Jerry Schenwar 24:59 So it was really interesting. I actually went to check out the 2905 Farragut in the city and [it's a] big, old house. Really nice. I think now as compared with the 60s Lincolnwood is whole lot more diverse and more interesting. You know? We've got very international, which is nice. Lev Kalmens 25:27 Is there anything about Lincolnwood that made you feel like you really belong here? Anything that comes to mind? Jerry Schenwar 25:33 I really enjoyed watching the eclipse from the school. They had like a little event for the eclipse. Lev Kalmens 25:44 Right. Two summers ago now. Jerry Schenwar 25:48 Was it that long ago? Lev Kalmens 25:49 I think so, I think it was 2017. Jerry Schenwar 25:51 You know, the big, where the the glasses -- Lev Kalmens 25:53 Yeah it was the whole thing. Jerry Schenwar 25:54 Yeah, that was that felt like a nice community event. I liked that. Lev Kalmens 26:01 Well, Jerry, I want to thank you for coming down and sharing your Lincolnwood story with us. Jerry Schenwar 26:05 Very happy to. 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Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- John Rossi https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/814b2412673cd0f63bdab5a7fb6ef777.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=oU10wCpGelNcpQTHQoRw5K8GquyIDM8NiNPSGikJxBziIU51wSRWZwiYpoglgazckOYn2xHPWN4hal3Cj5VgmP1BVw-LYzGMyBvfv-pVCbswwYD13MrvAeI-UHWO-BCeYdfM4EhVDw%7EuqVMaTeDiKzbXPEB6y12FhI1srXVMlROaT54uOQxAJz68kXJC1CjODXLNxqYGaOcfStUGvWRfrhHK6DbYjC0O3c7Q5xfFKdZm0H9zhjC0F75xBYtzZOWd6x%7EbzFL3ZczlOvisUq%7EKu0KxJOEImWs-AhnXIn0sIijAwF6AgOsxejdRxBx9yl4CekV9g7SLU8ULmMxi49tGJg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM b6858b24530f39cdde69147308014277 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource John and his pet turtle, Hardhead, 1958 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/995883e9d642a22f9664f0b4714dbdfb.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=dOjPWqvliiVb5MhonobSyPC2SkxKonurpgyhuqDwbmtFAeiFmY3aPmCg7BC1T54fs4Vc7Z9A6cIvwzOsjgvRpsQiF1BL23Acjs%7EDTwI5X6tyJlpSonnPnFi0EvwX7WknDCPcw1wo412MOcfmgsMVT1Y8uCs%7ExrJOPHlawNVnOG5Zb9snP0Xo9MdUAj5UmCNvcu1BBTbQ%7EYWXEJgPUKX1F7LqXvKbB3jIW-VAJ%7E3r5p093hBJcmltGSIjuNISptfsu-1reAn4%7EidDQkxo3jponNC9BLdG5svxoJR3FrtjnEknyhZgOkTjIMGvW0lxijgwGGNaeq1kM9d%7Eb-7csYJ44Q__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 81ea6ba6f92a8bf7181e313d1799c8ac Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource John’s (circled on left) kindergarten class, 1958 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/a70460eab6b32c3ec27039f8a40b2eba.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=bSfB6P3kZzS3VJAl3cdl0Ryn26JF4gwmKa4HJDG44gNzbxixXb%7EsGh-AA9jOEnYItNXREt3TZaXNhfOW3UAElJZHcHklJZmJsPOCZZcUHFdvCMmqdMZ9Y0CUCN2O1nYgXfVuwfwmQtGR-aacpKpvMVyIveug9lkiw1c6sy5Ibke1JTzvxBbFr4sybtKEgjN%7E61yxIa0dBw55z%7EUQOQtyvW61S4fjYMRUSioy4PvkAM51MGJaoRs4iZasJHIRZxm4nzCyY21OArR6luGqRpxatIKEPDPrfhGIJrwX9nmFZq7xfT2R5gDHMKdj4UXjnvVbytf5hY3ZYFJiZ16mB7AVIA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 8669c420775b4978403e465faae6c7b9 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource John and Tiger, 1965 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/8e30200f00b19f7eb4e6c954b81a70df.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=dS61CtkMppx51iR78EItP5nZ8I6G7lYF3zrHB-4N0RzXOjhyvXyfaxqadY7DoOFTRE8OcaTCAzD8JQ8FKwpZZns%7Eldk9loGdJzXpjDuR7hRMhKmMb1TF8gEDV46AOP3WVehjJOOzlsicZcs8HZ2uaZHoo68DIQ9fx73jqOacoFCmdJ3J76GHVKJ-QraUqYUIRWOo0ZQ6dTtRVFUkeOSBE2YXRiy2bYagUOyPS%7EnO8U38LIRP48WsM-kk%7EQKuyCUUmB9pNllLoOt300B5K66raOrG%7Em%7EWGl3JXcvhnUXM5DuFV1%7E6h%7EjYM7WFKfofvxcJKNACEMObkwpadovcWtPljg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM c8610a3c053890a2b3d690ce6fced75a Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource John (left) and Dick (right) Rossi, with their father, Richard Rossi (center), 1971 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/1000935273dc1560cf28106218badfc3.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=pfL3IB69193bWqSsAbQ%7EKpts5iYrDKauatjrJynbuQdMNqQMyQKXNK7s%7Enlum-93-g%7EVF1X%7EaVxVMaHw6AcyQPlOeo1SnLzT8HvpLkojrwO72t-rcSCcsPgjObmn-NH1VW3p6asp5OV5NF8yaBoZuWjFecCNv3eAhlOBb0KyK%7EOigun-Pp233WLPToFFPg7ii7WYC-kzGn%7Etin%7EnPhfcVHMGRCS0pFuwmJgJ3n5kw-GQH6rkPWEcYTi5UYQIII9aNqr6175Oxvs3uRdzZNww7rMEgfeTLukofikOx4Xt4FqxAFwfWcJMOZy%7Em%7ER5rZ66RpOU5DVFvYEfO0qxgI4d3Q__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM a74aaecdd059bcf8850e66030609b79f Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource John Rossi and Chuck Miller https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/bb734a7fbd3952a660dd01f7dcb392c5.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=RmzRcLRMKFgShIYWHvW40KV2u%7EA71z6kIB-otuwm3iUsw4JsYohhNx98PMup%7Ebw4pKb4YWeD8dmW21THwvb8yxExLp123Q9zRvx3LLLO3OZPdwl-r76Ke8aikjv5BgqLKjj8tCxsJnkfHnYYuDSusGBQU%7EoVCxsQXPOvH6Qvzb%7E%7ETlLD9Y53cbIFKnwuzNEBG0yabnbvYIr6hS3urRtwafjdNst2th%7Enn-OHEaXtTggJwNas5bA5CMVpre5YU4OBc2q3DVePHBlJZrIdPWpuM%7Er6HVZ27JGi2rN27Kz8sIVfE82v4cEgj9YxKNoSeoit%7EfD4vq0Vld0pWMPg5VkKNQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 309e4fa70da1240a1eeae33209746f87 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Keystone Park renamed to Rossi Park https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/c06d1dcc2826884a6c30725a70f35eff.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=eruENGX76dR3HO6rXXX5E0kbvGgs3ajbSrjo-9ZCMn4H-s%7EB9W1ykBf8t-0yC4Uq8qIWUhE%7EmhV1TMYs14pH-oJm7LmbgrDqyzEER0p4CegCq3%7EckcSYqR6H%7EUYYi9upq3ocnP5fTGn8ldsjBkwOzu0JhNzLx0h86%7ECyog7pSgAfGNxC7MUXxII1-Vm4Z2UBUJaxcKVUEkcGd3WBWFtZO%7ExfGLHhHCw41GIQYEZsVH3yVzGf4o0nklDMtFFbhNN37AFhVMa0dWP3SHhjnQjYxI0TMTWws2pGTMU5s97aQex9gTgLWudK4nvIwqjZH600ls3KcsJU4JF7%7ECnzbBEZRQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 9bfd1ed3ff4f6f7dc33c332d9f3a9ff4 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Richard R. Rossi Park on Keystone Ave. https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/18401eb19a81fea077f8cab369d28eb1.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=U%7Ej%7E0Alo92ST5MhATXGq9Jg3tZd9up9sGM0-Zp2yH5ODCbWaXDh1L1hiwMVim7BThHcxY6r7SMZlNkPrDKNl1MkZDINj54VhzkO632HSZx6JtBUWzA3Zs-iiiMDkuYxeAhNbs%7E5Iyiow4VHk82MZP3P7jNTAXtPzj0OsSHVGU34LKkxbQ28Jg53%7EozUQ0N5ja9Luogi9I97nIsIThw0tqwYB3Gz452escC5NoURneTdoKBS9B7NFgx7xbJWF8msJP98dJEBSVyk7FA0s1YmnT%7EDfKBJogtmgw8c4sJ71LrqJ-gOm8MW7FpTXr%7Er8UtM4i1g3z0yqVLpTkgOM1TsQ1A__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 4d0fe47d6b429d03e7afae67ae198c13 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource The former Rossi house in Lincolnwood Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- John Rossi Subject The topic of the resource “Being so close to the city, you could do things when you were 13 or 14 years old, that you couldn’t do in the other suburbs. Like take a bus to the Cubs game.” John Rossi is interviewed by his daughter, Juli. He talks about his childhood in Lincolnwood, his various jobs growing up, playing baseball, and participating in community traditions such as seeing the Lincolnwood Towers holiday decorations and the annual Halloween bonfire in Proesel Park. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Julie Rossi 0:00 Today is April 23rd--Right? Yeah--2019. My name is Julie Rossi and I will be interviewing my dad, John Rossi, for My Lincolnwood Story. So, hi, Dad. John Rossi 0:13 Hi, Julie. Julie Rossi 0:14 How are you? John Rossi 0:15 I'm good. Julie Rossi 0:15 [Laughs] Good, good, good. So I guess we're just gonna talk about what it was like when you were growing up in Lincolnwood. John Rossi 0:22 I guess so. Julie Rossi 0:24 So how old were you when you moved to Lincolnwood? John Rossi 0:26 Just over one. So we moved here in October of 1954. Julie Rossi 0:32 Do you know why your parents picked Lincolnwood? John Rossi 0:34 My Grandma, Grandma Berger, my mom's mom, owned some lots in Lincolnwood, for some reason. And my grandfather died six years earlier, and they decided to build a house on one of those lots. Julie Rossi 0:46 Your grandmother on which side? John Rossi 0:48 The grandmother that lived with us. Julie Rossi 0:49 Oh, that's right. Grandma Berger. Right? John Rossi 0:52 Yeah. Julie Rossi 0:52 And she lived upstairs. John Rossi 0:53 Yeah, she lived upstairs. So they built the house on Keystone. Julie Rossi 0:57 That's awesome. I love that house. So when they first moved to Lincolnwood, it was you and Nonnie and Poppy-- John Rossi 1:07 I was a year old. Uncle Dick was like eight and a half and Auntie Betty was almost eleven. So I was the baby. Julie Rossi 1:14 And then where did Uncle Dick and Aunt Bettie go to school? John Rossi 1:16 Queen of All Saints. Julie Rossi 1:17 Both of them? John Rossi 1:17 Both went to Queen of All Saints. Julie Rossi 1:19 I don't think I realized that. John Rossi 1:20 Yeah, they both did. That's where they started when we moved here. So there were a lot of kids at that time who went to Queen of All Saints. Julie Rossi 1:26 Really? John Rossi 1:27 Yeah. My understanding now is Queen doesn't have any kids from Lincolnwood. But at the time, there was tons of us. My whole block went to Queen of All Saints. Julie Rossi 1:35 Okay. [Laughs] And you did too. John Rossi 1:38 Well I did for first grade; I went to kindergarten at Todd Hall here in Lincolnwood. Julie Rossi 1:43 What is it? John Rossi 1:44 Well, one of the buildings is called Todd Hall. That's where I went to kindergarten, which was cool. I got to go with some kids that I would have never met, but a lot of the Queen of All Saints kids went to kindergarten here. Julie Rossi 1:55 Okay. That's kind of neat. John Rossi 1:59 Yeah, there was a lot of building going on I guess when we moved in. I don't remember that that much. There was a few empty lots on our block. We used to play in the house behind my house. Our house was under construction, so we played in there all the time. And then one of my friends fell in a hole once and cracked his head open, so they wouldn't let us play there anymore. Julie Rossi 2:16 [overlapping] Wait, what? John Rossi 2:16 [Laughs] When I was five or four, one of the kids that lived behind us fell in a hole in the empty house -- when they were building the house behind us -- fell into the basement. There was no walls. There was just ladders and he fell off the ladder. Julie Rossi 2:29 Didn't you have some neighbor who had birds? Joe-- ? John Rossi 2:34 No, Joey? He still lives on Keystone. Julie Rossi 2:36 Does he still live on Keystone? John Rossi 2:37 [Laughs] Julie Rossi 2:39 That's crazy. John Rossi 2:40 We won't drop any names. Julie Rossi 2:41 Okay, no names. That's totally fine. So you moved here when you were one. And then what did Poppy do when he first moved to Lincolnwood? John Rossi 2:51 He worked Downtown. He was a photo engraver. He worked behind the Sheraton on Michigan Avenue--off of Michigan Avenue. Now there's all condos and high rises there. It was a little two shop building. But believe it or not, the funny thing was, he used to get a ride from one of our neighbors to work every day. And then he used to come home, someone would drive him home and drop him off on the Edens Expressway--not at an exit, just pull over to the side and drop him off. And we would sit on on Cicero, and he would come up the hill and hop in the car and we'd drive home. [Laughter] Julie Rossi 3:22 So he just like made his own bus stop. John Rossi 3:24 Yeah, they stopped in the middle of the expressway. They would pull over on the shoulder, and he would get out. Julie Rossi 3:29 It's just exactly something that Poppy would do. John Rossi 3:31 They didn't get off the expressway. Julie Rossi 3:35 "Just pull over here." I can see him just diving out of the car while it's still rolling. John Rossi 3:38 I don't remember when the Edens was built. It was built before I remember, but it was probably built when I was like five or six. Julie Rossi 3:45 He worked Downtown, and then didn't he eventually work in Lincolnwood? John Rossi 3:51 No, he never worked here. Julie Rossi 3:52 He never worked in Lincolnwood? John Rossi 3:54 No. When we moved in, there were so many people moving in here. Julie Rossi 3:58 Right. John Rossi 3:58 It was the baby boom. Everybody had kids. There was like thousands of people. What happened was Poppy got involved in this whole baseball thing. My dad was a big baseball fan. Julie Rossi 4:09 He was like the baseball coach. We called him Poppy Coach. That's true. Like it's not even an exaggeration. Everybody called him Poppy Coach. John Rossi 4:16 Well, they had so many little league teams, and they didn't have enough teams. And so Uncle Dick was nine the next year or 10 or something, and he tried out for a team and didn't get picked. So my dad went and they had tryouts at Lincolnwood School which is right over there. Julie Rossi 4:30 So Poppy started a team just so Uncle Dick could play baseball? John Rossi 4:34 [overlapping] [inaudible] the son of a guy my dad went to high school with, they lived in Lincolnwood -- Julie Rossi 4:38 I thought you weren't gonna say names. John Rossi 4:40 Oh, you're right, I'm sorry. Julie Rossi 4:41 [Laughs] John Rossi 4:41 They didn't get put on a team, and so they went over and complained to my dad, to Poppy, that they didn't make a team and "we're as good as those guys, but they said if we got a coach they'd give us a team." So, Poppy started coaching and he coached for like 40 years. Julie Rossi 4:43 Poppy, by the way, is Richard R. Rossi, and there is a park named after him, called Richard R. Rossi Park. Is the park on Keystone? John Rossi 5:01 On Keystone. 7000 block of Keystone. [Laughter] The park that you guys went to when you were kids and threw kids out of because you said it was your park. Julie Rossi 5:09 [overlapping] Because we were like, "this is my grandpa's park. You guys can't come here." John Rossi 5:13 So that's how he got involved in baseball. And the rest is history. Julie Rossi 5:16 And he was involved in the [American] Legion here too, right? John Rossi 5:21 Yeah, a lot of the World War Two vets were in the Legion. So he was involved in the Legion, then he coached baseball. Eventually he got into the park--I guess the Park and Recreation board, which was like a subcommittee of the trustees. And then in the '80s, he became a village trustee, which he was for like 15 or 20 years. The guy who had no political--like couldn't tell you who the vice president was--became a village trustee. If it wasn't a sport, he didn't know it. Julie Rossi 5:54 But he knew every single baseball player ever. John Rossi 5:58 Yeah. But he got into the running of it. And he was basically in charge of it. He was on the zoning commission all the time. Julie Rossi 6:03 Okay. John Rossi 6:04 So when they built the library, it was a big deal. When they built the Lincolnwood Town Center, it was a big deal because those were things that were changing. Julie Rossi 6:11 And then Poppy knew everybody because he coached all of their little league teams. John Rossi 6:15 Yes, he did. Yes he knew everybody. Julie Rossi 6:18 So my dad will look at old pictures of little league teams or something like that. Didn't you say that there was something on your Lincolnwood Facebook group? John Rossi 6:26 Yeah. A lot of them. Yeah. When I was a kid, for a boy that was born between like 1945 and 1965, in my little world, baseball was king. And that was what we did. We'd play in the streets, before I had a mitt, I played with the older kids. Uncle Dick played all the time. All my friends played, and then it just grew. The best thing about living in Lincolnwood was how small it was. So you could ride your bike anywhere. And I don't know if they still have it--they had a big summer camp at the big park, which is now called Proesel Park. And you would go there for first through eighth graders going into second and going to eighth is what it used to be. And if you went there every morning, what the boys did was play baseball for two and a half hours. That's all they did. And the girls would-- Julie Rossi 7:21 So it's barely a camp. John Rossi 7:22 And then we went home at lunchtime, then some of us came back in the afternoon because they had arts and crafts and stuff that most of the boys didn't like. Julie Rossi 7:28 So it was just like supervised baseball kind of? John Rossi 7:30 Yes. It was like twelve-inch softball. And Uncle Dick was a counselor when I was there. Julie Rossi 7:34 Did that -- was that -- John Rossi 7:35 It was horrible. [Laughter] He was going into high school and I was going into second grade. He was a junior counselor, then he became a full counselor. Yes. And I had to be in his group one year where he was my baseball instructor. Julie Rossi 7:51 And then he became a teacher. John Rossi 7:52 When he got out of college, Uncle Dick taught at Lincoln Hall for like seven or eight years. Yes, he did. And Nonnie, your grandma, started working at the village hall. So yeah, we're all over the place. Auntie Betty and I didn't do anything. Well, then I worked at the village hall during the summer. I picked up the garbage. Julie Rossi 8:06 But didn't you say Auntie Betty got married at the Purple Hotel? John Rossi 8:09 She did. Her reception was at the Purple Hotel. [Laughter]The Lincolnwood Ritz. Julie Rossi 8:15 Which is gone now. Right? John Rossi 8:17 Yes. Julie Rossi 8:18 We were driving around looking for a place to eat, and he's like, "I think the Purple Hotel is over here." No, it's not. It's gone. John Rossi 8:23 It's gone. They knocked it down a while ago. So anyway. But yeah, Lincolnwood--what I loved about living here, and I probably didn't appreciate it at the time, was well there wasn't a lot of traffic because there were no streets. Julie Rossi 8:37 What? John Rossi 8:38 Well, there are no main, busy streets like Devon was the southern border. Touhy wasn't really the northern border, but it was kind of. There was a couple blocks north of Touhy that were in Lincolnwood. And then on the east side, it was McCormick. On the west side, it was Central. So Pratt was the only kind of halfway busy street that went through the whole town. But there was no cars on it because they couldn't cross the canal on McCormick and it ended at Central. So you could ride your bike anywhere. There was not a lot of cars to worry about. It was Nirvana. It was great for a kid, which I didn't really appreciate at the time. There was just not a lot of cars, now there's a lot more traffic, but it was just different back then. Between Devon and Touhy was where Lincolnwood was, and that's where we always were. I started riding my bike. We'd ride our bike to that day camp every day, and there'd be thousands of kids riding away from there every afternoon. At Lincoln Avenue, they finally had to have a policeman stop the traffic. Julie Rossi 9:38 Like the great summer camp migration? John Rossi 9:40 Yeah. And you know what it cost? Like $3 or something for six weeks. Julie Rossi 9:44 Of course it did. John Rossi 9:45 Yeah, it was unbelievable. It was something to do every day. And most of the kids you knew went there. I knew a lot of the kids I met in town were because of the camp or little league. Julie Rossi 9:57 After camp days, when you got a little bit older, where did you hang out? John Rossi 10:02 I actually-- Julie Rossi 10:04 Parking lots? John Rossi 10:05 No. Julie Rossi 10:05 [Laughs] John Rossi 10:07 When I was in like seventh and eighth grade, I actually had a job, kind of, working. I sold subscriptions to the news-- Julie Rossi 10:14 You were a newsie? John Rossi 10:14 Yes. Julie Rossi 10:14 I did not know that you were a newsie. John Rossi 10:16 [overlapping] -- which was a local newspaper for Niles Township. And they paid us a quarter for every news subscription and 15 cents for renewal. And we would just go door to door. We would ride our bikes to the news office, which at that time was by Niles East High School, and there'd be like eight or ten boys that are 12, 13, 14 years old. And this guy would put us in this big convertible with all 10 kids in there--this was really safe--and then just drive us to neighborhoods in Morton Grove, Niles, Lincolnwood, or Skokie and just drop us off for three hours. And we would walk door to door, split up the blocks, and ring doorbells and talk to ladies, talking them into buying subscriptions. It probably would be child abuse today [laughs] if they did that. Julie Rossi 11:01 Yeah, I don't think they could do that. John Rossi 11:02 And at the end of the day, if you sold a couple subscriptions, you'd make a couple bucks. And it was the money we needed to spend or, you know, hang out. Julie Rossi 11:08 To buy chocolate shakes. John Rossi 11:09 To buy chocolate shakes. Because then in high school, my friend's parents bought the Baskin Robbins on Touhy. So I started working there my freshman year in high school. Julie Rossi 11:19 And you worked there forever. John Rossi 11:20 No, I only worked at that store for a little less than a year because they got rid of it. And then what happened was I started working in the store in Edgebrook. And then I worked at the Baskin Robbins in Edgebrook on Devon until I went to college. Julie Rossi 11:31 Right. And didn't you say that you were from Lincolnwood and you worked in Edgebrook, and all the guys that lived in Edgebrook worked at L-Woods? John Rossi 11:40 There were many of my friends from Edgebrook [inaudible] that worked at Kenilworth Inn is what it was called. So we were crossing on the way to work [laughs]. So I worked at Baskin Robbins, which is a great job if you were-- Julie Rossi 11:52 --in high school, yeah. John Rossi 11:53 I went to Loyola Academy. It was an all-boy high school, so who buys ice cream? Girls! [Laughter] So that's how we met girls. Julie Rossi 12:04 So you hung out at Baskin Robbins. John Rossi 12:06 I used to hang out at Baskin Robbins in high school a lot. Julie Rossi 12:07 Did you even go there on your days off? John Rossi 12:09 Yeah. Julie Rossi 12:09 And you're all like, 'I'm just gonna go hang out at Baskin Robbins." John Rossi 12:11 Well, we would meet there and then-- Julie Rossi 12:13 "In my sweet car." Didn't you have a sweet car? John Rossi 12:16 I had a 1969 Mustang. Julie Rossi 12:19 Yeah you did. John Rossi 12:20 That was actually my mom's. Julie Rossi 12:22 Damn straight. John Rossi 12:22 That I drove all the time. [Laughter] Julie Rossi 12:26 I love the idea of Nonnie just driving around in a '69 Mustang. John Rossi 12:29 Yeah. It had a 351 engine, and I got a ticket going 97 miles an hour. Julie Rossi 12:35 On the Edens? Were you going to pick up Poppy? John Rossi 12:36 No, I was on the Indiana tollway. Coming back from college. Coming back from school. Julie Rossi 12:36 Got this sweet ride, you're just goin' 97. Oh, wait a minute. Didn't you guys go to Windsor? But we're not talking about Windsor. John Rossi 13:01 We got some more questions here. Julie Rossi 13:03 Oh, sure. More questions. Let's see. Oh, I believe you wanted to talk about the Legion Hall dances? John Rossi 13:11 Yeah, you know. Yeah, that's another thing. When I was in seventh grade, they started doing these teenage dances at Lincolnwood. At the Legion Hall. Every Friday night--I don't know what it cost to get in--they would have bands play. And a lot of big name--well, eventually, what became decent local bands would play there. And so from 7 to 11, every Friday night, they had these dances. And so I was at the end of seventh grade and I was a big kid. So I was 12. I wasn't even 13 yet. And they needed kids to work at the dances, and they wanted kids whose parents were in the Legion. So I started working there when I was like in May of my seventh grade year because I was 5'11. Julie Rossi 13:55 Were you like a bouncer? [Laughter] John Rossi 13:57 No, I hung up coats, and then we'd work behind the bar and passed out drinks. Passed out Cokes. There was soft drinks. So I worked there. And then I worked there all through eighth grade, and then by the end of eighth grade, the kids that I knew, that were my age were old enough to actually go to the dances. Julie Rossi 14:12 Did you work there when he kids [inaudible] John Rossi 14:13 [overlapping] Yeah, it sucked. Everybody in eight grade thought I was cool because I worked at the dances because I was really young to do that. Julie Rossi 14:29 When you were working at the Legion Hall dances, were there also like American Legion members just like sitting around being all like, "Kids these days." John Rossi 14:36 Yeah. No, your grandfather was a bouncer as well as many of the other Legion members. Julie Rossi 14:41 But Poppy would be a terrible bouncer. He would just let everybody in. John Rossi 14:43 No, he was a bouncer. Dr. Calahan, Mr. Serentakis, there was a lot of them that were bouncers. Julie Rossi 14:48 Who are those guys? John Rossi 14:49 They were other Legion members. Julie Rossi 14:50 Okay. And they're all just friends? John Rossi 14:53 And the boys who worked there were all Legion brats, like sons of legionnaires. Julie Rossi 14:56 Legion rats? John Rossi 14:57 Brats. Julie Rossi 14:57 Oh, brats [inaudible]. I like calling you guys the Legions rats better. John Rossi 15:02 But it closed when I was like a sophomore in high school. Julie Rossi 15:04 The whole Legion or the dances? John Rossi 15:05 The dances ended. There was a big fight and someone actually had a problem. Julie Rossi 15:11 What? John Rossi 15:12 Someone got stabbed. Julie Rossi 15:12 [gasp] At the Legion? John Rossi 15:14 Actually in the park. A kid in my class actually. He didn't get killed. Julie Rossi 15:19 He got stabbed? By who? John Rossi 15:20 Another kid. Julie Rossi 15:22 What? What a jerk! What kind of knife? John Rossi 15:24 Lincolnwood dances kind of turned into--the normal kids stop going there--it turned into all the like troublemakers. And it got worse and worse and worse. Julie Rossi 15:33 And Poppy did a worse job bouncing. John Rossi 15:36 Evidently. After the dance one night, one of the kids in my class got stabbed. He wasn't in my class. He had gone to grade school with me. Julie Rossi 15:43 Where? Like, in the arm? John Rossi 15:44 [overlapping] He was a Niles West student. Julie Rossi 15:45 Like in the arm though? John Rossi 15:45 In the side. He was fine. Then they ended the dances after that. Julie Rossi 15:50 That sounds crazy. John Rossi 15:51 Yeah. Julie Rossi 15:52 Due to a local stabbing, the Lincolnwood Legion ... John Rossi 15:54 Yeah, they ended it. But I worked there often. I worked there like, yeah, almost all the time it was open. Julie Rossi 16:00 Really? John Rossi 16:00 Yeah, pretty much. I was really happy when it ended. Because I didn't have to work there anymore. Julie Rossi 16:05 Right. And then you got to get your job at Baskin Robbins. John Rossi 16:08 [overlapping] Well, every Friday night was kind of a crap shoot. Because I used to have to work at Baskin Robbins a lot on Saturdays. So yeah, so it was kind of awful. Yeah. Julie Rossi 16:17 Right. John Rossi 16:18 So I mean, there were days I didn't. I mean, if I had a baseball game or something, I didn't work at the Legion that night. Julie Rossi 16:22 How long did you play baseball? John Rossi 16:24 I stopped when I was 16. Julie Rossi 16:25 Okay. John Rossi 16:26 I played much longer than my ability. But yeah, the baseball program in Lincolnwood was--I don't know how to explain it. Most of the kids I knew played but some didn't. But for a little town, from 1969 to 1974 had amazing success at the older level. It all started with a group of guys that were like my older brother's--your Uncle Dick's--age. So they were like, six to 10 years older than me in that group. And they were in a college team that did very well and won a central states championship. And a lot of those guys played in college. Julie Rossi 17:05 But not like through their colleges. John Rossi 17:07 No, it was a summer league-- Julie Rossi 17:09 [overlapping] Where did they go to college? John Rossi 17:09 St. Joe's and Rensselaer. But not their college teams. Julie Rossi 17:12 College level. John Rossi 17:12 It's what they did while they were in college. Julie Rossi 17:15 Right. Okay. John Rossi 17:15 So all of us younger kids would go and watch them all the time. And it got to be that baseball became the Lincolnwood thing. And I know it's all because of, you know, it's mostly because of your grandpa, my dad, because your Uncle Dick wanted a place to play in the summer. So they started a college team for him. And he got all these guys that-- Julie Rossi 17:35 [overlapping] So he started like three different leagues. [Laughter] John Rossi 17:38 Yeah, basically. And they got this league together. So what that did is the kids that were four to eight years, 10 years younger than them would watch them play and get really into this baseball stuff, and we'd play all the time. Julie Rossi 17:53 Right. John Rossi 17:54 And so in 1969, they started a big league, they called the Big League Program, which was 16-, 17-, and 18-year-olds. It was a division of Little League. They also had a Little League and then a Senior League for 13-, 14-, and 15-year-olds. So when I was still in the Senior League, they started this Big League. Julie Rossi 18:12 Okay. John Rossi 18:12 And the first year, the Big League--they picked an all-star team that went to the Big League World Series in Winston Salem, North Carolina, but I'm not sure how they did. I know they didn't win it. But then in 1970, the team from Lincolnwood went to Fort Lauderdale for the Big League World Series and won the whole thing. And it just snowballed and everybody wanted to play after that. Everybody wanted to go to Florida. Everyone had to try it. So then in '71-- Julie Rossi 18:37 And did Poppy coach that team? John Rossi 18:40 He was like an assistant coach on the '70 team. Julie Rossi 18:42 Okay. John Rossi 18:43 He coached the '71 team. Julie Rossi 18:45 Gotcha. John Rossi 18:45 And the '71 team came in second place in the world series. Julie Rossi 18:49 Okay. John Rossi 18:49 '72 team didn't go anywhere. They lost in the regionals. Julie Rossi 18:53 [overlapping] Bunch of losers. John Rossi 18:53 But, the Senior League all-star team, the 15 year olds-- Julie Rossi 18:56 Okay-- John Rossi 18:57 Made it to the Senior League World Series which was way cool. Julie Rossi 19:00 That is pretty cool-- John Rossi 19:01 That was actually a bigger deal because there were so many more Senior League teams than Big League teams. Julie Rossi 19:04 [overlapping] Yeah. John Rossi 19:05 So those guys were just behind me. Julie Rossi 19:08 And didn't Poppy always say something to the team members? John Rossi 19:11 I'm not sure. Well, then the '73 team won the Big League World Series, and the '74 team came in third in the national tournaments. So in five years, they were in the national tournament four times. Julie Rossi 19:25 Which is awesome. John Rossi 19:25 No, in six years, they were in it five times. Julie Rossi 19:27 Right John Rossi 19:27 That they made it through the states, the regionals, and then the World Series. It was incredible. Yeah. One of the guys that--I'm quoting a guy that's actually on Lincolnwood Time Machine--he'd sent me a message that said-- Julie Rossi 19:41 Which is a Facebook group. John Rossi 19:42 Which is a Facebook group. And one guy said to me, "John, I remember your dad telling me, 'You're a world champion and nothing, no one will ever take it away.'" He goes, "I've thought about that for the last 50 years of my life that your dad told me that." Julie Rossi 19:56 Yeah. John Rossi 19:56 "He said that I was once a world champion." Julie Rossi 19:59 Which is awesome! John Rossi 20:00 Yeah, it is pretty cool. Julie Rossi 20:01 That's cool. John Rossi 20:02 So then after that, it's just like the younger kids just weren't into it. It kind of ended. And you know what it was that there was the population started to go down. There weren't as many kids anymore. Julie Rossi 20:10 Right. John Rossi 20:11 But little Lincolnwood was on the map with those first six years for doing. And I know that allegedly in Williamsport, Pennsylvania--allegedly,I don't know if this is true--at one time, there was a thing that they sent my dad--they sent Poppy--a letter saying he was one of the few coaches at that time to have won a world title twice. Julie Rossi 20:32 Really? John Rossi 20:32 Yeah, from 1970 and '73 I guess is what it was. Julie Rossi 20:37 Wow, that's kind of cool. John Rossi 20:38 Yeah. So one of my, like, bucket lists was to go to the Little League Hall of Fame someday and see that. Julie Rossi 20:44 Oh, [inaudible overlapping]. Because is his name there then?. John Rossi 20:47 I don't know if his name is. Lincolnwood's there, though. Julie Rossi 20:49 I guess we're gonna have to road trip. [Laughter] John Rossi 20:50 So that was a big deal. I mean, I was around one of those teams. Julie Rossi 20:59 How long did he coach Little League? John Rossi 21:02 From 1955 till probably 1975, -76. Julie Rossi 21:10 Oh, okay. John Rossi 21:11 You know when he stopped? Julie Rossi 21:11 When? John Rossi 21:12 When Jay started playing. Julie Rossi 21:13 Oh, because then he went to all of went to all of Jay's games. John Rossi 21:15 His oldest grandson. When Jay was eight-- Julie Rossi 21:18 [overlapping] His first grandchild. Yeah. That makes sense. That makes sense. John Rossi 21:23 Yeah, there's an article in the paper, "The father of Little League baseball retires," and they had a picture of Poppy and Jay in it. Julie Rossi 21:31 By the way, here's a park. John Rossi 21:32 Yeah. No, the park came later. Julie Rossi 21:34 Oh, no. The park came in like the late '80s. John Rossi 21:35 It's because he was a Trustee. That's what the park came. Julie Rossi 21:37 Yeah. John Rossi 21:38 All the parks in Lincolnwood are bouncing here. Julie Rossi 21:41 Bounce away. John Rossi 21:43 You know, Henry Proesel Park. Mr. Proesel was the mayor for like 50 years or something. I don't know. He might still be in the Guinness Book of World Records for having been mayor of a municipality the longest of anybody. Julie Rossi 21:56 Really? John Rossi 21:57 His grandkids went to school with me. Julie Rossi 21:59 Okay. John Rossi 22:00 Henry the third was in my classes. A friend of mine. But there was, you know, Richard Rossi Park--my dad, he was a trustee. Charlie O'Brien has a park. Julie Rossi 22:12 I bet his park's not as good as Poppy's park. John Rossi 22:14 [overlapping] G. G. Rowell has a park. These are all fathers of people I grew up with. And Les Flowers was the chief of police for a long time and there's a park. Julie Rossi 22:22 Okay. John Rossi 22:22 And they named all four of those other parks I think at the same time is when they dedicated all four of those to Mr. O'Brien, Mr. Rowell, my dad, and Les Flowers, chief of police. So it's pretty cool. The nice thing about like having your dad be so politically connected is I could never get in trouble. Julie Rossi 22:37 Yeah? John Rossi 22:39 I was going 55 miles an hour down Touhy one time, and someone pulled me over. And I went, "Oh, God, I'm gonna get--" It was like, I just got my license. And I thought I was gonna get in big trouble. And pulled out my license, and he said, "Are you Richard Rossi's son?" And I went, "Yeah." And he goes, "Okay, just slow down." [Laughter] Julie Rossi 22:59 I didn't get any of those breaks growing up. John Rossi 23:00 Actually, you know, I know Jay got a break one time for the same reason. Julie Rossi 23:04 I'm sure uncle Dick got a break at the same time. John Rossi 23:06 I don't know. He was already gone, you know, when Poppy got to be a trustee. He was married in '71. So, he wasn't around that much. The other thing that was unusual is people were--and probably a sign of the times--you know, because it was small, we knew a lot of people. When I was like eight, I went to Queen of All Aaints, so that was kind of far away from where we lived, I had to go home at lunchtime to have some drops put in my eye. I'd screwed up my eye. And of course, my brother was supposed to pick me up because he was off of school that day and he was in high school. Well, he never came. So I started walking home, and I got lost, which is normal when you're eight, you don't know not to get home. And some lady just picked me up and she said, "What are you doing?" And I said, "I'm just looking for my parents' house." I said my name. She goes, "I know your parents and don't you know the Mancusos? They live over on the next block." She took me over to Mrs. Mancuso's, and I stayed there till they could get a hold of my mom to come and get me. Julie Rossi 24:00 It was that kind of place. John Rossi 24:01 Yeah. Julie Rossi 24:01 You just get in a car with a stranger. John Rossi 24:03 Exactly. Yeah. Julie Rossi 24:04 Didn't even have candy. John Rossi 24:05 No. And this woman, I've never met her in my life. I know what her name is: Mrs. Midwood. I met her son later on: it was Billy Midwood who was a little older than me. But yeah, I didn't know her at all. I was just walking down the street all by myself. And I think she saw this kid, an eight-year-old, in the middle of the school day that shouldn't have been walking down the street probably. Julie Rossi 24:22 And now that would definitely be considered a kidnapping. John Rossi 24:25 Yeah, well, maybe, or they wouldn't have let me leave the school. Julie Rossi 24:28 Probably not. I guess that's more accurate. Yeah. John Rossi 24:31 [Laughter] But at that time, they let us. When I was in first grade, I got in an accident at school. I knocked a tooth out in the bathroom. And my brother was in eighth grade. They called my mom and she wasn't home. She was out somewhere. So they just let me go with Dick--Uncle Dick. Like, "Okay, go home guys." I walked out of school and go, "What do we do now?" And he goes, "I don't know. We're not in school anymore." They just let us loose. It was a different world back then. Julie Rossi 24:58 I feel like I would have been a lot out of school. John Rossi 25:01 I don't know. We just took a bike out of the bike rack, rode home, and biked back the next day. Julie Rossi 25:05 Yeah. John Rossi 25:08 So I don't know. It just was a different type of play. But Lincolnwood was a small community. Everybody knew each other. It was great. Julie Rossi 25:14 What were the holidays like in Lincolnwood? Was it like a magical fairyland in the winter? John Rossi 25:18 The Lincolnwood Towers, people say it's nice now. It was unbelievable when I was little. Julie Rossi 25:24 What are the Lincolnwood Towers? John Rossi 25:26 They're an area--I guess it's west of Cicero, in between Pratt and Devon. When I was a kid, there was a lot of famous people who lived in there. Julie Rossi 25:26 Who? John Rossi 25:31 Jim Moran, which at one time was one of the Forbes 500, owned a car dealership, and had a TV show on WGN, and he lived in there. Andy Frain--there was Andy Rrain Ushers. Julie Rossi 25:51 Oh. John Rossi 25:52 Andy Frain lived there. Julie Rossi 25:53 I worked for Andy Frain once. John Rossi 25:53 [overlapping] And Auntie Betty went out with his son in high school. Julie Rossi 25:54 Of course, she did. John Rossi 25:57 Of course, she did. And some of the houses there were incredible. I know there's some of them still have the Christmas tree going through all the floors and the taxidermy reindeer. But there was there was-- Julie Rossi 26:13 We're talking Christmas decorations, right? John Rossi 26:15 Yeah, Christmas. There was a choir and like an actual singing--not people but a recording. Julie Rossi 26:21 I was thinking, like they hired children? John Rossi 26:22 [overlapping] I don't know. Some kind of animatronic choir that would sing songs in front of a house. Queen of All Saints school had live animals and a manger when I was really little. It was just unbelievable. And I don't know what it's like now, but remember when you were little, we'd drive through the towers? Julie Rossi 26:42 Yeah, even in the '80s, we would drive through the Towers. And it was just bumper to bumper traffic just going down like side streets, and everybody's just taking pictures of that crazy clock with Santa like going around in a circle like a cuckoo clock thing. John Rossi 26:55 And the elves also? Julie Rossi 26:56 Oh all the elves making--I don't even know if they were making candy. John Rossi 27:00 There were a lot of like plastic. To these people, they were like Disney World decorations. Julie Rossi 27:04 Yeah, they were straight up serious about their Christmas decorations. John Rossi 27:08 And it's still pretty famous. But it's not anywhere as elaborate as it used to be. Julie Rossi 27:11 Yeah, it was everything in the yard even in the '80s. John Rossi 27:14 [overlapping] Like everything else, people move so they stop. Julie Rossi 27:17 Didn't some of the houses like sell the decorations with the house? John Rossi 27:20 Some of them did. Yeah. Julie Rossi 27:21 Which is crazy-- John Rossi 27:23 Some of them do. Julie Rossi 27:23 And kind of awesome. John Rossi 27:24 Well, the house that has the Christmas tree that goes through all three floors ... Julie Rossi 27:26 Yeah. John Rossi 27:27 I know the people that grew up in that house. Julie Rossi 27:28 Is that the same one with the fake deer? John Rossi 27:30 Yes. Julie Rossi 27:31 Yeah. John Rossi 27:32 [overlapping] Obviously went with the house because they still have it. Julie Rossi 27:34 Yeah. John Rossi 27:35 That was the Boulder family when I was a kid. Julie Rossi 27:36 Oh. Of course, you remember all of their names. Was it really just Christmas, or were there any other holidays? Like Fourth of July? Big Fourth of July things in Lincolnwood? John Rossi 27:48 Lincolnwood didn't even have a fireworks display. Julie Rossi 27:50 Really? John Rossi 27:51 No. The other big one was Halloween. Julie Rossi 27:53 Okay. John Rossi 27:53 Halloween, they--and I think they still do this at the big park--they would have a hot dog thing after trick or treating at night. Julie Rossi 28:00 Okay. John Rossi 28:00 So they had like a bonfire. Julie Rossi 28:02 Was it like a Super Dog hot dog thing? John Rossi 28:03 No. It was like an Oscar Meyer gross hot dog. [Laughter] There would be hundreds and hundreds of kids there after trick or treating that'd go to the park and have hot dogs. I know they did that for a long time after because I know Poppy had to go there all the time on Halloween night and do that. Julie Rossi 28:21 As a trustee? John Rossi 28:22 Well, he just liked doing it. Julie Rossi 28:24 He'd just like going there and talking to people and telling stories. John Rossi 28:28 Yeah, so they had that for a long time. And I guess the kids didn't have to be driven places. And I know the whole world was like that: kids could ride their bikes differently. But it was actually safer here because there weren't any-- Julie Rossi 28:38 It was even like that when I was a kid. John Rossi 28:40 There weren't any big streets, though. Julie Rossi 28:41 Like, I rode my bike everywhere. John Rossi 28:43 Yeah, we didn't have to cross any main streets. Julie Rossi 28:44 Yeah. John Rossi 28:45 So it was a little bit different. Julie Rossi 28:48 Yeah. John Rossi 28:49 Yeah, it was nice. Julie Rossi 28:50 What did you want to be when you were growing up? John Rossi 28:53 A cartoonist. Julie Rossi 28:53 I know you did. [Laughter] Tell me about the comic book shop where you used to go. John Rossi 28:59 No, comic books were bought at drugstores back then. Julie Rossi 29:02 It was just a drugstore? John Rossi 29:03 Yes, Orlov's. It was right across, kitty corner from here. Julie Rossi 29:05 Okay. John Rossi 29:06 Which is now, I think it's a Walgreens or something. Yeah. Used to be Orlov's pharmacy. Yeah. My friends and I, we'd get off the bus and go stand there and wait for the comics to come out on Thursdays. Julie Rossi 29:14 Just every Thursday. John Rossi 29:14 Till they unpacked them and then buy a couple and bring them home. Julie Rossi 29:18 [Laughter] And that's it, just go to that drugstore? John Rossi 29:22 Or we'd go to the other drugstores later in the week to get other things, but yeah. Julie Rossi 29:26 Did you guys trade comics ever with each other? John Rossi 29:28 No. Julie Rossi 29:29 It was like everything you bought was just yours? John Rossi 29:30 Always, usually. Julie Rossi 29:32 Yeah? John Rossi 29:33 You know, I still have some of them. Julie Rossi 29:34 I know you do. John Rossi 29:35 I retired on them. Yeah, I thought I could be a cartoonist, but I found out I couldn't draw. Julie Rossi 29:44 Right. John Rossi 29:44 I met kids who could really draw. Then I decided no, I better not do this for a living. Julie Rossi 29:49 I feel like when I was little, Nonnie had this--or maybe it was yours, I'm not sure--but it was like this big plastic thing that had a light shining under it so you could learn how to trace. And that was yours, and then Nonnie always let me play with it, so I could learn how to draw. John Rossi 30:03 Yeah, when I was a little kid, they bought me that so I can learn how to draw. Julie Rossi 30:05 Loved that damn thing. It was great. It didn't work, though. John Rossi 30:09 Well, my mom went to the Art Institute. Julie Rossi 30:10 I know--oh. John Rossi 30:10 She was an artist. For one year. Julie Rossi 30:12 I knew that she was an artist, but I didn't know she went to the Art Institute. John Rossi 30:14 Yeah, she did. Julie Rossi 30:15 Okay. She went to the Art Institute, and then when did she start working for the village of Lincolnwood? John Rossi 30:21 When I was in college. Julie Rossi 30:22 Oh, so way later. John Rossi 30:23 Yeah. She only worked there for about 10 or 15 years. Julie Rossi 30:25 She only worked there for 10 or 15? That's a long time. John Rossi 30:28 She was probably in her mid 50s when she started there. Julie Rossi 30:30 What was she doing there? John Rossi 30:32 She actually started on just filling in for people who were sick. Julie Rossi 30:37 Okay. John Rossi 30:38 And then on vacation. Julie Rossi 30:39 [overlapping] Probably just because all of her kids had moved out. John Rossi 30:41 They taught her how to run like an accounting software. And then I'm like, "Are you kidding? You're like 65 years old. How are you going to learn how to do?" So she did some accounting thing after a while. Yeah, but she worked there for a while. Yeah, so she worked at the village, Poppy was a trustee, and Uncle dick taught at the school. Julie Rossi 30:57 Yeah. John Rossi 30:57 And I picked up the garbage during the summer in college. Julie Rossi 31:00 Well, you didn't tell me. I forgot that you were a garbage man. John Rossi 31:02 I was a garbage man. Julie Rossi 31:03 Oh. John Rossi 31:05 I worked for the village during the summers when we picked up our own garbage. Julie Rossi 31:08 You were a newsie and a garbage man. John Rossi 31:10 We actually decorated one of my friend's apartments with what we found in the garbage Julie Rossi 31:13 And a garbage decorator. John Rossi 31:14 Yes. If someone was throwing a couch out or a chair, we wouldn't pick it up. I'd tell we'll come back. We'd come back later and get it and bring it to his-- Julie Rossi 31:22 And just put it in his house? John Rossi 31:23 His apartment, yeah. Julie Rossi 31:26 We did stuff like that in college too. John Rossi 31:28 So anyway. Now all that stuff's licensed out. They don't have their own garbage men anymore. Julie Rossi 31:34 And you can't just steal things from the garbage dump. Or from the garbage. Well, you can take these from the side of the road, but not like ... All I'm saying is that I've picked up furniture from the side of the road before. John Rossi 31:45 Because my dad was a trustee, when all of us kids were out of the house, then the villagers actually plowed there snow a lot, which they never did when I was a kid. I would have liked that because then I wouldn't have to do it myself. Julie Rossi 31:56 [overlapping] you wouldn't have to do it yourself? John Rossi 31:58 But they did. They did it after, you know, all of us were gone and he was getting older, the village would come and do his driveway. Julie Rossi 32:04 That's adorable! John Rossi 32:05 I know. Julie Rossi 32:06 That's so cute. That makes sense. It's a long driveway. John Rossi 32:09 Yeah. Julie Rossi 32:09 It was a long driveway. John Rossi 32:10 There used to be a lot of factories behind the school, east of the school. [inaudible overlapping] Just thinking of other stuff that was around here that's gone. Well, I started thinking about that they threw out Oscar Mayer Weiner whistles. So the kids used to ride their bikes up there and go through the garbage, speaking of going through garbage. Julie Rossi 32:27 Oh, God, you would just go through the garbage and take thrown out whistles and just use them? John Rossi 32:30 Yeah. And then we would bring them home and wash them, and we'd have Oscar Mayer Weiner whistles. Julie Rossi 32:33 You didn't wash them, and you know it. John Rossi 32:34 Probably not. Well, when we got home, we had to wash them. Julie Rossi 32:36 You would stick them in your mouths. John Rossi 32:37 Well, we did, but by the time we got home, our moms made us wash them. Julie Rossi 32:41 I'm like there's no way. You brought them home, and then Nonnie would yell like, "Where'd you get that?" And you'd be like, "I found it." "Did you wash it first?" "No." John Rossi 32:47 No, she knew we got it from there. Julie Rossi 32:49 [Laughter] Like there's no way you washed it. John Rossi 32:54 Lincolnwood's a lot. We're sitting at the library. This was a Jewel. Julie Rossi 32:57 Right. John Rossi 32:58 Not a big Jewel but a Jewel. Where I bought all my baseball cards when I was a kid. Julie Rossi 33:02 What were your favorite restaurants when you were a kid? John Rossi 33:04 There weren't that many. People didn't go out to eat. Julie Rossi 33:06 Really? John Rossi 33:07 Like Burger King is about the most biggest restaurant I ever had. That's right. Julie Rossi 33:09 Right. We drove past the Burger King, and my dad was like, "I used to ride my bike to that Burger King." And I was like, "Very cool, Dad." John Rossi 33:15 Lou Malnati's took over a restaurant that was called Novak's. Julie Rossi 33:21 What was Novak's? John Rossi 33:22 Just a restaurant. Julie Rossi 33:23 Okay. John Rossi 33:23 And then it was the very first Lou Malnati's on Lincoln. And Novak's I guess didn't have a liquor license, or there was a waiting list to get liquor license. And my dad was on the zoning board at the time. So Lou wanted a liquor license. Julie Rossi 33:42 Good old Lou. John Rossi 33:42 And somehow my dad got him a liquor license, so we used to get free food at Lou Malnati's because he wouldn't have opened without that liquor license that my dad got for him. Uncle Dick had his rehearsal dinner at Lou Malnati's for his wedding. Julie Rossi 33:54 I think there's some connection between Poppy and Dominic's? John Rossi 33:57 Grampy, your grandpa. That's nothing to do with Lincolnwood, though. Julie Rossi 34:00 No, no, but it's just a story. No? Okay, that's fine. John Rossi 34:04 My grandfather was Dominic's first butcher. Julie Rossi 34:06 The first butcher at Dominic's, which is gone now, so it doesn't matter anyway. Okay, let's see. So Grandpa--not Grandpa 'cause Poppy--Poppy's dad was the first butcher at Dominic's. John Rossi 34:23 Right. Nothing do with Lincolnwood. Julie Rossi 34:25 But where did he come from? John Rossi 34:26 Italy. Julie Rossi 34:27 Yes. Where in Italy? John Rossi 34:29 That's got nothing to do with my Lincolnwood story. Julie Rossi 34:31 It's part of your life. John Rossi 34:32 I'm fighting with my daughter on this thing. Julie Rossi 34:34 It's part of your life. John Rossi 34:36 [inaudible] Godforsaken little town in the middle of Italy. Julie Rossi 34:40 Okay, okay. And you actually went there? John Rossi 34:41 I went there a couple years ago with one of my cousins. Yes. Julie Rossi 34:43 Which is awesome! John Rossi 34:43 It was neat. It was cool. Julie Rossi 34:47 You didn't find any old like Rossi relatives, did you? John Rossi 34:51 We found them after we left. They tagged us on Facebook. Julie Rossi 34:54 Oh, right. They found you guys, which is kind of cool. John Rossi 34:57 Right. Julie Rossi 34:58 And Aunt Pat's gone back there. John Rossi 34:59 She goes back there and stays with them. Julie Rossi 35:01 But it's kind of neat that they moved over. What about like the Berger side of the family? John Rossi 35:05 I don't know much. Julie Rossi 35:06 No? Which is funny because Grandma Berger lived with you guys on Keystone. John Rossi 35:09 Yeah, but Nonnie was an only child. So I didn't have a lot of cousins. All the cousins on that side were second cousins. Julie Rossi 35:15 How long did Grandma Berger live with you guys? John Rossi 35:16 My grandmother lived with us. I don't know. After I got married. She died the year I got married, so ... Julie Rossi 35:26 '77? John Rossi 35:25 28 years. Well, we moved in in 1954, and she died in 1978. 24 years. And she lived with us for 24 years. Julie Rossi 35:26 That's crazy. John Rossi 35:34 I did thought it was normal. One of my neighbors thought that she was our cleaning lady. Julie Rossi 35:39 Really? John Rossi 35:39 She didn't know she was our grandmother. She had a different last name. Julie Rossi 35:43 Like a servant's quarters? Julie Rossi 35:44 [Laughter] That's awesome. John Rossi 35:49 Yeah, she was with us forever. Julie Rossi 35:50 Which is crazy. Because I feel like Nonnie was cleaning constantly. Couldn't they just tell that like Nonnie cleaned? John Rossi 35:55 Who knows? Julie Rossi 35:56 Yeah. Okay. So let's see. So your jobs because I never even knew you were a newsie. So you were a newsie. John Rossi 36:05 I was an newsie. Julie Rossi 36:06 And then you were a bouncer. No, you were a coat checker. John Rossi 36:10 And yeah, and I passed out pop. Julie Rossi 36:12 And then you sold ice cream to ladies. John Rossi 36:15 Yes. Julie Rossi 36:16 Not ladies. John Rossi 36:17 Girls. Julie Rossi 36:17 To girls. John Rossi 36:18 And everybody else. Julie Rossi 36:21 And then you were a garbage man. John Rossi 36:22 For the village. Julie Rossi 36:24 And then you moved out of Lincolnwood. Right? John Rossi 36:27 I moved. When I graduated college, I didn't live in Lincolnwood. But then right before I got married, I moved back for a few months. Julie Rossi 36:32 Right. John Rossi 36:32 So and then I left and got married. Julie Rossi 36:34 What about Uncle Dick? What else did Uncle Dick do in Lincolnwood? Did he have any weird jobs? John Rossi 36:37 He was a he was a counselor at the day camp for years. Julie Rossi 36:39 It's so weird to me that he was a counselor and then he was a teacher because it's like such a normal trajectory for like a career path but not for Uncle Dick. John Rossi 36:40 [Coughs] Excuse me. He was a counselor at the day camp for probably four or five years. Julie Rossi 36:53 Okay. John Rossi 36:54 And then when he got out of college, he taught at the school. Taught math, seventh and eighth grade math. Julie Rossi 36:58 If you have to pick one thing - John Rossi 36:59 Which wasn't bad wasn't good, because I was only like a freshman in high school when he started doing that. Julie Rossi 37:03 Oh, okay. John Rossi 37:04 So I knew a lot of the kids he had in class. It was awful. Julie Rossi 37:08 Did those kids ever, like complain to you about Uncle Dick? John Rossi 37:11 Constantly. Julie Rossi 37:15 Of course they did. John Rossi 37:18 He taught there, six or seven years. Julie Rossi 37:21 Neat. Cool. John Rossi 37:23 He liked it. Julie Rossi 37:24 But you went to Loyola, right? John Rossi 37:26 Yeah I went to political science in the Loyola. So I didn't go to Niles West. I didn't go to Lincolnwood school. Julie Rossi 37:30 Did you still have friends that were going to Lincolnwood High School? John Rossi 37:32 Tons of them. Julie Rossi 37:33 Yeah. John Rossi 37:33 You couldn't not - it was a small town. So yeah, playing baseball going to the camp your met kids from everywhere. Julie Rossi 37:39 I guess that's true. Yeah. John Rossi 37:40 It always surprised me when I met a kid when I was older who lived in Lincolnwood that I didn't know as a child. Julie Rossi 37:45 Really? And you still know a lot of them, like, you still talk to them. John Rossi 37:49 I thought I knew at least almost all - there are a lot of girls I didn't know. Because I wasn't really into girls. Julie Rossi 37:53 Cause you went to an all boys school too. John Rossi 37:54 Plus in high school. It was different because I had a driver's license by then. So I was leaving a lot. But I knew if I met a boy who had been here a few years, and I didn't know him. That was weird. Julie Rossi 37:55 Especially with all the baseball stuff. John Rossi 38:02 And baseball, soccer camp. Yeah, just having friends that went to Lincolnwood school going to their bar mitzvahs and stuff like that. It was just, yeah, met a million kids. Julie Rossi 38:18 Which is awesome. Is there any favorite singular experience about growing up in Lincolnwood that you want to share? Before we go? John Rossi 38:26 Do I want to share anything? Um, no. I don't know. I thought I thought I didn't appreciate this area until I left. Julie Rossi 38:39 Yeah, that sounds... Yeah. John Rossi 38:41 It was such the thing that and I don't know if it's like that now. And I have to think it's probably like that, because it was so small. And it had at one school. Three buildings, but one school, all the kids had to be at the same school. So the kids all know each other because they all were at this - good or bad - they all know each other. Now, I didn't go to that school. But I did - Julie Rossi 39:02 Still knew everybody. John Rossi 39:02 Knew a lot of kids from those schools. I think that - and then it was - being so close to the city, you were allowed to do things - well, or not be allowed - you could do things when you were 13, 14 years old, that you can't do in the other suburbs, like take a bus to a Cubs game or go downtown or just buy do things on your own. Julie Rossi 39:28 Because of the ease of it as well. John Rossi 39:29 You just knew what to do. You just knew where to go. You know, it's just, and I don't think I appreciated that. I know when I was when I was in high school. I wanted to live in an area where all the kids went to school together. And maybe it's because I went to a different school where you know, every kid you met you, they would know each other. Right? And so I thought moving out to Naperville was going to be more like that. But and it was I mean neighbor, you you lived in it. It's great. It was a great living in Naperville. Julie Rossi 39:55 It was a wonderful place to be until I was about fourteen. John Rossi 39:57 What I found out being in a big - those big high schools So far away from- that's more trouble kids getting, there's more trouble out there than there is around here because there's more for kids to do. Kids get in trouble and there's no doubt kids are gonna, you know, kids around here aren't going to get hurt in car accidents because nobody can drive fast. So I didn't appreciate what this area had to offer till I left. How does that sound? And I kind of wish I never did in a lot of ways. Julie Rossi 40:25 Is that what you miss most about Lincolnwood? John Rossi 40:27 Yeah, I miss the proximity to Chicago. I miss that the most. Julie Rossi 40:30 Yeah, you come to Chicago to visit me all the time. John Rossi 40:35 But the accessibility of the city is what I miss the most. Julie Rossi 40:38 Well that's awesome. Cool. I think we got to wrap this up now. John Rossi 40:42 Probably, they're gonna throw us out. Julie Rossi 40:44 They're gonna kick us out of the library. John Rossi 40:45 Hopefully nobody will ever listen to this. Julie Rossi 40:46 Everybody's gonna listen to it. Everybody needs to listen to this. John Rossi 40:52 Well thank you for interviewing me. Julie Rossi 40:53 Thank you for having me interview you. John Rossi 40:54 Did we cover all your stuff? Julie Rossi 40:56 I'm - Yeah, sure. Why not? This was a general - I'm looking at it like a list of talking points. It was a general list. It's good. I think we did good. But thanks again. John Rossi 41:05 Thank you. https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/8e074d199df219b759ad5b6b8d0a40c9.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=JHbcm990jaUyXIPvv9ec0T5CuS2JCm8cfnnNWHMQtYX%7EUmhuhg1R1H1ORJSS4hGpGthfyD88hrJfldjNOvA5xaRb96tVHktDOZ4lsseLVjbSuk1Chs2Icj67nJr9fA0jLhb6pr2aFJfPcmqNFNQaO6Xq0OyyQgZmAb6aKELreuUFrhepQzE8sLb5eRy66yfsRaLYdk96-P6i4o66wUDQNqORgDJvlIcpmMpu5kbQ2yrWoatwdDv%7E7O6kMluie5fuY9R7u8YGIfTLb7lwjdNzzesoUTkfeVtJOxgjxU9ljiQHwJ5K5k7U9t0Q4lJPfo4WmHvcAXE69LQEwtQCfLGWAQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM f67624d581f7ffd3de0cdeab8fdbe6af Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Kamran Hussain (left), and Howard Lee (right), 2019 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/5606652edd3f0de523640b1a8c6c28bd.mp3?Expires=1781740800&Signature=FpZHHXjWkLycDXcZ-SjbUNHA7wmiQMM-JN6%7EdGOWVZ5N-svYHOPvbmTjxZi2WNphrHnAgOpCMRFjXQXY2LQmEKuGLga6SxMlX8ynHKn5Hd-Yf4nobSTDHgU-eoZV7B6PNauQAwJQriVexem5wb-rSnLJ%7EBiMAu5H7k-TraziDVYDdIG6CqfPezegTZqNXGFnUmXEiPdUjB8x71EmhzBurCk61lWAlb0we77DVws%7EB3YI2MB8nu6SvjrAY-rkINZX2VIwuh6mW2AFh-5uf0xxYagKgCalb9zfJjBziTBCq60vM1TcxeXLAEABMP0klRQoF1CJPXnugdVf2%7EV9WSQijg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 6753a14fcea27bb5cba4c10a6eacccce Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Kamran Hussain and Howard Lee Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Kamran Hussain and Howard Lee Subject The topic of the resource “I think if you lived in [Chicago], or the north side, you might have dealt with a lot more minorites. A lot more differnt races as opposed to Lincolnwood and the northern suburbs.” Kamran Hussain and Howard Lee, friends since the 2nd grade, talk about and reflect on their childhood in Lincolnwood. They discuss the changing ethnic demographic of Lincolnwood and the various changes the village has undergone since the early 1980s. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Howard Lee 0:00 Hello, my name is Howard Lee and I'm interviewing my friend for 35 years Kamran Hussain, for My Lincolnwood Story. Kamran Hussain 0:11 So, funny thing about my name, my name is actually pronounced Kamran. And, Howard, you probably already know that because you probably heard my mom or my sister say that. But the funny thing is, it is kind of like a Lincolnwood story, it's just been like an insecurity of mine. Probably when I was in kindergarten, that's what they called me. And I was just probably too young and too insecure to really make any corrections. Can't I just let it be? And so, what's funny is that my son, who's now nine years old, his name is Obeid. And he's totally not insecure. And he goes to a school that kind of reminded me of Lincoln Hall and Todd Hall when I was growing up, and he corrects people left and right, if they pronounce his name. The principal pronounced his name wrong, and he corrected him. I was kind of surprised the principal even knew his name. I don't think our principals ever knew our names. Well, Mr. Zyks knew your name. [laughs] Howard Lee 1:10 Well, the statute of limitations is probably too late. So we'll stick with Kamran. Kamran Hussain 1:14 Yeah, I was insecure about it and now I'm not. Now I just let it go. Now it's like, if I tried to correct it then I knew that I'd get into a long conversation and the teacher would take forever to kind of correct it. And then I'd get into a conversation about correcting it so, my insecurities just let it go. And it is what it is. Howard Lee 1:35 Well, Kamran, how old are you? Kamran Hussain 1:37 I am 42 gonna be 43 in a couple months. Oh no, shoot, in a month. You're gonna be 43, too, right? Howard Lee 1:44 Yeah, you're gonna be 43 in like two weeks. Kamran Hussain 1:47 Yeah, three weeks, yeah. Howard Lee 1:50 And what years did you live in Lincolnwood? Kamran Hussain 1:53 So I was born and raised in Lincolnwood. My mom and my parents and my two sisters moved here in 1975. I was born in '76. So they literally- I don't know if my mom was pregnant when they moved here. But I was born at Illinois Masonic and born in Lincolnwood. Howard Lee 2:14 Okay, and you lived in Lincolnwood until you went off to college, correct? Kamran Hussain 2:19 Yeah, I mean, let's just say I lived in Lincolnwood until I was 25 years old. I'm Indian and Muslim. So I kinda have to stay home until I moved on with my life. So I went to college. I went away for college for a few years, and then grad school for a couple years and then... once I started working I was back in Lincolnwood. Howard Lee 2:39 Okay, now you have three sisters, correct? Kamran Hussain 2:43 Yes. Howard Lee 2:43 And you have two older sisters and one younger sister, correct? Kamran Hussain 2:47 Yeah. Two of my older sisters. And then I have a younger sister, four years younger than me. Howard Lee 2:52 So your sisters were not born in Lincolnwood? Kamran Hussain 2:55 No. So my oldest sister was born in India. And she came here, maybe in 1970 when she was like one or two years old. And then my other sister was born in Chicago in '71. But they essentially went to Lincolnwood schools because they- we moved in '75. So my oldest sister was about six or seven. She started second grade. And then my youngest sister started, I think, preschool or kindergarten. At Rutledge Hall. Howard Lee 3:22 Okay. Now you attended Todd Hall, Rutledge Hall, Lincoln Hall, and Niles West, correct? Kamran Hussain 3:26 Yup, I did it all. Howard Lee 3:28 And uh- Kamran Hussain 3:30 And we met in what, second grade? Kamran Hussain 3:31 Second grade, yup. Kamran Hussain 3:32 You moved in second grade, right? Howard Lee 3:33 I moved to Lincolnwood in second grade. Kamran Hussain 3:34 I can probably name all my teachers from preschool to eighth grade. But I'm kind of forgetting my first grade teacher's name. Howard Lee 3:44 Well, we'll get to the school part. Kamran Hussain 3:45 [laughs] Okay. Howard Lee 3:46 So how is it your family ended up in Lincolnwood, specifically Lincolnwood? Kamran Hussain 3:50 Yeah. So my dad came here, I believe in '68. Howard Lee 3:55 To Illinois? Kamran Hussain 3:56 To Chicago. And he had a residency at Illinois Masonic. Howard Lee 4:01 Your dad's a physician? Kamran Hussain 4:02 Yeah. My dad was a surgeon. And then he... So he came here. And my mom didn't come at that time. My mom was still in India. So I assume my sister was born around that time in '68, or whatever. So my dad came here. He kind of got settled and then my mom moved here. So my parents lived on Devon Avenue, close to the hospital and close to the lake, too. And then they lived there for a couple years in a couple of apartments. Couple different apartments. I'm not exactly sure where. And then I think the story goes is that my dad, just you know, we're obviously- the family is getting bigger and he wanted to move. Once he's finished his residency, he they were looking for a house and he drove around Lincolnwood and he actually fell in love with the neighborhood. And Lincolnwood is an awesome city- an awesome suburb- just because it's like the closest suburb to the city. Literally gets to downtown in 10 minutes if no traffic. So they found a house in Lincolnwood. And that's it. Howard Lee 5:09 Now, overall, would you say that you had a positive upbringing in Lincolnwood? Kamran Hussain 5:16 Yeah, I think definitely. When I look back on it, definitely positive. But when I also look back on it and analyze it, probably when I was going through that time, definitely there was a lot of insecurity that was going on when I was growing up. I mean, when I look back on it all seemed fun to me. And I enjoyed my time when I was in school. But I do kind of recall being quite a bit insecure about my place in school. You know, you're Chinese. I'm Indian. We grew up in Lincolnwood when there was hardly any minorities. It was kind of changing, the dynamics were definitely changing in the 80s. And it definitely was changed in the 90s. But we were kind of like the few minorities. Well actually, looking back now at it now our classmates, a lot of them were actually minorities. It's just, I didn't really realize it. Until now, you know. First generation kids. I wouldn't say minorities, but more first generation kids. Their parents were also from a different country. But I just didn't know that. I just assumed they were white. Howard Lee 6:20 So growing up in Lincolnwood in the 80s and the early 90s. You know, just looking back on it, what would you say is the racial makeup of the community? And then a follow up question would be what would you say the racial makeup of the school population was at that time? Kamran Hussain 6:37 I mean, from my understanding, and I wasn't paying attention to it too much. I always knew that I was different because of the darker skin than most people there. From my understanding, Lincolnwood was very Jewish at that time. I just remember every other weekend kids would come back with the T-shirts from going to someone's Bat Mitzvah. And granted, I wasn't invited to many of them. Both 7:06 [laughs] Kamran Hussain 7:08 So when I look back at it, I remember a lot of our friends being Jewish. And so that's what I kind of got out of it. And there was a few minorities sprinkled here and there. And you know, you could tell just whenever it was Christmas time, our neighborhoods weren't all lighted up with Christmas trees. Because there was a lot of Jewish people in Lincolnwood. Howard Lee 7:31 Were Asians relatively commonplace, or were African Americans or Latinos? Kamran Hussain 7:36 African Americans, zero. Latinos? You know, when I look back on it, I realize that there were a couple people that were Latino that I just didn't know that they were Latinos. Asians? You can kind of answer that, probably not? I mean, there were a couple Indians in our grade- me, Himanshu Patel, Manisha Patel, Daruk, and a couple more here and there. Chinese? I mean, I wouldn't say Chinese. Asian, there were a lot more. You and then I can name quite a few more. Howard Lee 8:08 Yeah, I think there were a lot of Koreans in Lincolnwood at one point. Kamran Hussain 8:10 Yeah, so definitely there. There was. Howard Lee 8:15 Well, let me ask you. You kind of alluded to this. That, you know, as a person of color and a racial minority. Did you ever feel like part of the community in Lincolnwood? Or did you feel like an outsider? Kamran Hussain 8:27 I don't know, I mean, I think that when I was living through it, it just kind of- it is what it is. I thought that my role in school was just, you know, being friends with the kids at school. And then, when school was over, I kind of had my own, you know, social and family life. I had a cousin that we'd hang out with, and then people- my dad was very involved in the mosque in the area. So I had friends that were Muslim that were involved that I would hang out with on the weekends. So school had school friends, and I thought, you know, that was my- that was normal for me. I didn't realize that all the kids were doing all this other stuff on the weekends without me. But yeah, I definitely felt it. I mean, you know, I was embarrassed when my mom would come for being the lunch lady. My mom had a nose ring at that time. And you know, I got asked by so many kids, "Oh, why's your mom wearing a nose ring?" And you know, those same kids that made fun of me were like all grungy in the 90s and they all had nose rings in high school.[laughs] So yeah, I mean, those things I could definitely feel. But yeah. Howard Lee 9:43 Well, I mean, so growing up in Lincolnwood in that particular period. You'd mentioned you had friends- Indian friends and Muslim friends as well- in other communities. What was your experience in comparison to theirs when you heard about what their experience was in their respective communities? Kamran Hussain 10:01 Well I think Chicago at that time was still kind of, you know, the minority... there wasn't that many minorities in Chicago. Especially on the north side at that time. Or just anywhere in Chicago, right? So I think we all kind of had similar experiences. I think if you lived in the city or the north side, you might you might have dealt with a lot more minorities, a lot more different races. As opposed to Lincolnwood and the northern suburbs. It was primarily white. And you know the Asian population, whether it be Indian, or from East Asia, they were growing, but we were still kind of considered a minority. Now, when I see- when I walk around Lincolnwood now, or Skokie, or you know any of these suburbs around here, if I see an Asian person I don't even bat, I don't even do a double take. Where I could see 30 years ago, if I saw an Asian I'd be kind of surprised. Howard Lee 10:55 Did that change as you got older? Cuz I feel like Lincolnwood, certainly by the time we were in high school, it was not as much of an issue was it was when we were [inaudible]. Kamran Hussain 11:06 Oh, yeah. Once we hit high school- by the time I think we graduated high school, I mean, dude, there was a lot of minorities. Howard Lee 11:13 Cuz I feel like Niles West at that point was probably 20-30% Asian. Kamran Hussain 11:20 Maybe. You know, my wife teaches at Niles West now. And she could probably tell you that it's probably over 50% minority. Howard Lee 11:28 Oh, interesting. Kamran Hussain 11:30 Yeah. Howard Lee 11:31 Well, so your two older sisters, were not born in the United States- Kamran Hussain 11:37 No my oldest sister was. Howard Lee 11:38 Oh, sorry, your older sister was born in India. And you and your two other sisters were born in the United States. And your sister's older, too. Your oldest sister is quite a bit older. Do you feel like their experience in Lincolnwood was different than your experience? Kamran Hussain 11:56 So me and my sister Ramana, who we're like four or five years apart, I think we had similar experiences. So she was probably going to junior high and high school, early 80s. We were kind of like mid to late 80s. So we kind of had similar experiences. My oldest sister who is about nine, eight years older than me, she definitely had a different experience. So there was even less minorities there. And there was a lot more, I don't know if she necessarily got harassed, or had, you know, physically got made fun of. I think I probably got made fun of here and there, but it just kind of like- Howard Lee 12:34 Well look at you, I mean- [laughs] Kamran Hussain 12:35 [laughs] That's true. But I know that from talking to my oldest sister, her experience of growing up in high school was not necessarily a positive one. I mean, I think when we all look back on it, it's all, you know, that's our childhood. We always had positive experiences, but it wasn't like something that she was so excited about. I know she didn't go to her 10 year reunion because she didn't really feel like going to it. Whereas, opposed to me and my sister Romana, who's four years younger than me, and my younger sister- four year older than me. And my younger sister was four years younger than me. We all had more positive experiences growing up. Howard Lee 13:19 Okay. Well, I mean, you're about to turn 43. So reflecting back, you know, 30 years later. Do you feel that in retrospect your childhood Lincolnwood was a positive one? Kamran Hussain 13:36 Yeah. I mean, I look at all my experiences as positive. Even if when I was going through it it was negative. I mean, you know, I guess everyone can take experiences a little bit differently. So for example, I remember once I posted this on Facebook. And [laughs] you know, it got a good reaction. And you realize that when you get older, all these little stupid things that you think are a big deal back when you were a kid, wasn't a big deal. And everybody was kind of going through these same experiences and insecurities and issues growing up as an adolescent. So for example, there was a store called Zayre. On Lincoln and McCormick- Howard Lee 14:20 By the Lincoln Village Theater. Kamran Hussain 14:22 -it was kind of a cheap store, right? And it was kind of like, maybe like at Kmart. And I [laughs] I remember I'd be embarrassed to go there with my mom. My fourth grade teacher was Mrs. Kistra- Howard Lee 14:37 Oh, yeah. Adia's mom. Kamran Hussain 14:38 -yeah. Everybody that grew up in the 80s and 90s kind of knew who Mrs. Kistra was. She was kind of the cool teacher at that time. Fourth grade. You wanted to get her. Howard Lee 14:48 Yeah. Kamran Hussain 14:48 And her daughter was also our age. Adia. Howard Lee 14:52 Yeah. Kamran Hussain 14:53 And so, I always thought of Adia as, you know, being one of the cool kids. And it was kind of funny, because I went to Zayre with my mom and we were buying some, whatever we were buying. You know, bedsheets or something like that. [laughs] And it was embarrassing, but I saw Adia Kistra's mom shopping at Zayre. And I always thought, you know, losers shopped at Zayre. And people that were poor or whatever shopped at Zayre. Or, you know, people that- that my mom was cheap. But it was kind of interesting. You know, once I saw her at Zayre. I was embarrassed at the time but then looking back at it, I was like, dude. It's nothing to be embarrassed about. It is what it is. If Adia's mom can shop at Zayre so can I. Howard Lee 15:40 Looking back, do you think... I mean, just thinking back on your friends that you grew up with and the friends you hung out with when you were a kid. What would you say the racial breakdown of your childhood friends were? Kamran Hussain 15:55 In school? Howard Lee 15:56 In school, yeah. Kamran Hussain 15:56 So basically, it's like I said, I had two different lives. I had one life that I'd go from eight o'clock to about 3:30. And that was school. And my friends kind of just lasted until there. Other than two, or three of my friends. One was Jason Trolovich, Mark Youngstead and Danny McCluskey. They lived- Mark didn't live near us, but he would always come to Jason's house. Jason lived right behind us. So our backyards connected. So Jason, Mark, Danny. Danny lived around the block on Kilbourn. And we would always hang out. After school we would play baseball in our backyards, we would hang out. It was funny, because we would just kind of hang out in our backyards or whatnot. So that was kind of like the extent to my friendships with kids outside of school. Once I started playing baseball in third or fourth grade, then it kind of expanded a little bit. But once again, it kind of was confined to those timings. On the weekends, I would hang out- Howard Lee 16:59 All those three guys are white, by the way. Kamran Hussain 17:01 Yeah, I mean- Howard Lee 17:02 So, I mean, was race a consideration for you at that point? Kamran Hussain 17:05 No, not really. It's kind of funny. Initially when I talked about my name- so I have a nickname at home it's Kamoo. Short for Kamran or whatever, right? So you know, Jason would come to my house all the time. And Danny would come to my house all the time. And they would hear my mom and dad, "Kamoo, Kamoo" or whatever, right? And they would hear it. And then you know, I don't know if they couldn't pronounce it properly, but they would call me Gamoo. And then from there, they would tell everyone at school. And so everybody kind of knew. Then everyone started calling me, "Gamoo, Gamoo, Gamoo". Howard Lee 17:40 I remember that. Yeah. Kamran Hussain 17:41 And it went on to high school. And the funny thing is, once again, because of my insecurities, I could not just tell them, "Hey, at least pronounce it properly." You know, it's not that hard. But I just let it go. And honestly, I see some guys around now and they still call me that. But yeah, that was mostly because they were my friends. Because of proximity. You know? My mom wasn't socially- my mom didn't socially hang out with any other parents. I mean, nowadays, my kids and my kids' friends and parents, I know them. So they have their little get togethers. But my mom never really socially knew anybody's parents. So I never went to anybody's house. I think yours is the only house I actually went to. So Danny, Jason, and then when Mark would come over, we would all hang out together throughout the summer and stuff like that. After school. Howard Lee 18:36 Okay. Well, then, as you got older and entered high school, and you know, I think when you're young race doesn't really factor into things. As you got older, was that more of a consideration? Or again, it just- race didn't play a role in who your friends were and who you hung out with? Kamran Hussain 18:51 No, I mean, in high school and school, it didn't. I hung out with- there wasn't too many Indians that I wanted to hang out with. Or they were there, you know- Howard Lee 19:03 Well, Himanshu, of course. Kamran Hussain 19:05 -Himanshu, being one. Now, when I hear stories about Niles West and Niles North or Lincoln Hall, there's so many minorities that you can kind of become part of a clique and hang out with, you know, your minority friends. I don't think we were like that when we were growing up? Howard Lee 19:21 I mean, as I look back, I don't think there were, quite honestly, enough minorities to form cliques. Kamran Hussain 19:28 Yeah, there wasn't. And I'm kind of glad that it was like that, because I was just able to get along with everybody. And we all kind of probably tried to be white to some extent, too. We kind of all tried to assimilate. Howard Lee 19:40 Well. So, you'd mentioned that you grew up, your backyard was adjacent to Jason Trolovich's- Kamran Hussain 19:48 Yeah. Howard Lee 19:48 -backyard. You grew up by Proesel Park, you grew up around the block. Kamran Hussain 19:51 Yeah, oh yeah. Howard Lee 19:51 Yeah, two blocks from Proesel Park. From the time you grew up to- and the fact is, your mom actually is still in the house that you grew up in. Kamran Hussain 19:58 Yeah. Howard Lee 19:59 So you have a lot of opportunity to come back to Lincolnwood. Kamran Hussain 20:01 Yeah. Howard Lee 20:03 Has Proesel Park changed a lot from the time you were a kid to now? And then the follow up question would be has the community as a whole changed a lot since you were a kid? Kamran Hussain 20:12 Yeah, the park has not changed in the way it looks. But you know, they've added different basketball courts. The basketball court used to have tennis courts. Where the tennis courts are now this tennis was still there with the basketball courts was on the south side of the tennis courts. And there was a big, just one basketball court. Now they moved the basketball courts to the west side. But you know, they still have the shelter. The outline of the park is essentially the same. The baseball fields are exactly where they are. They kind of added some new equipment and stuff like that. But the cool thing about that park is that it looks similar to what it looked like in the 80s. Howard Lee 20:52 Is it crowded nowadays, or? Kamran Hussain 20:53 No, it's still crowded. I remember when- probably it's not as crowded as it used to be. I think even after when we graduated. Probably, when I was in college, it used to get really crowded. Kids would be playing basketball. They have volleyball courts, now. People playing volleyball, you know, up until 11 o'clock at night. But the cool thing about that park is that it still has a very nostalgic feel to it. Howard Lee 21:17 Okay, how about Lincolnwood as a whole? Do you feel like it's changed a lot? Kamran Hussain 21:20 It's changed quite a bit. I mean, you can see the Purple Hotel is gone now. Howard Lee 21:25 [laughs] Oh, yeah. Kamran Hussain 21:26 McDades. I used to- grew up walking to McDades to buy toys. I'd go with my mom. McDades was where the condos are now on. On Touhy, right across the street from the Purple Hotel. Howard Lee 21:37 Oh, really? Okay. I don't remember that. Kamran Hussain 21:38 Bones used to be an awesome restaurant, still is. L.Woods is still a great restaurant. I personally liked it when it was Bones. But yeah, I mean, there's some different things. I mean, they have a little bridge on Touhy and a few different things here and there. The schools look different. They tore down- they basically made Lincoln Hall and Todd Hall- Rutledge Hall- a lot bigger. But yeah, I mean, you know, every time I come back- granted I come back quite often because I live close to here- it always gives me a nostalgic feeling. Howard Lee 22:13 Do you feel that Lincolnwood is- the changes are for the better for the worse? You feel like Lincolnwood was more quaint back in the day, or? Kamran Hussain 22:21 I mean, I probably think it was better back then just because I was a kid back then. So it gives me good memories. It's funny, all my neighbors were really old when I was growing up. My neighbor next to me, you know, they passed away. But, you know, when we moved in, he told us to call them grandpa and grandma. And that's what we used to call them. And they were awesome. They were our neighbors- when I would miss school and I was scared to ask my parents, they would take me to school. Howard Lee 22:48 Oh. Kamran Hussain 22:49 You know, that kind of stuff doesn't happen anymore. He would take me to school. When they were getting old and they would get sick they'd call us in the middle of the night my dad would go over and check up on them and stuff like that. Howard Lee 23:03 Well, you had alluded to the fact that you live close by. So you live in Wilmette now with your wife and your kids. Kamran Hussain 23:07 Yeah. Howard Lee 23:09 Now your kids are younger. But when you were growing up in Lincolnwood, how did you get to school? How'd you get to Lincoln Hall, Rutledge Hall, [inaudible]? Kamran Hussain 23:17 Bus. So funny story about that is when I started preschool, first day of school, I cried. So my mom had to come on the bus. The next thing I remember about that day at school was- that's probably my earliest memory- the next thing I remember about that day at school, was I just woke up and my mom picked me up. I think I just fell asleep the whole day. Yeah, I took the bus. Howard Lee 23:42 Did you ever bike to school? Did you ever walk to school? Kamran Hussain 23:44 I walked to school when I would miss school. When I'd miss the bus. And that happened quite often. Howard Lee 23:49 Is that something that you would feel- you know, when age appropriate here- you'd feel comfortable letting your kids walk to school? Or take the- Kamran Hussain 23:55 Yeah, we live close to school. I definitely would be open to my kids walking to school. And they're a little bit further away. And there's a couple more busy streets. But yeah. I think my son, he's nine and a half, I think he would be okay with that. Howard Lee 24:08 Okay. So you had mentioned hanging out in the backyard and playing baseball at Proesel Park. So just, if you could describe a typical summer day when you were, you know, 11, 12, 13 years old. Kamran Hussain 24:22 Yeah, so probably in third grade. I started playing baseball. I got into baseball. Baseball was obviously the popular sport at that time in the 80s. And I started playing. And, man, I liked playing baseball. So I started playing summer leagues, too. So that was kind of one thing that helped me kind of assimilate a little bit better, and be friends with a lot of the other kids. And granted, you know, we would play summer leagues, and we'd play in like, travel- well not necessarily travel- but we'd go to different towns and play. And that was a lot of fun. So I got to know a lot of the kids from our school. So that was kind of good because, you know those kids I played from like third grade all the way up until high school. And you know, it was cool, the coach- Jeff Pax's dad, Wally Pax- he would- literally every game we would travel to, whether it be Buffalo Grove or Palatine- he would take us to Barnaby's on Caldwell afterwards and all the parents would feed us pizza. So during the summer day, it would be- you know, my mom, I don't think my parents believe in summer school. But we never went to summer school. I never went to day camp. So I would wake up late, watch the Cubs game on channel 9, and probably, usually, go to baseball afterwards. And play baseball either play one game or two games and then come back home in the evening. And then usually go to my aunt's house on the weekends. My mom's sister lived in Skokie. So we would go there like every other weekend or people'd come over. Howard Lee 25:54 Okay. Kamran Hussain 25:54 Yeah. Howard Lee 25:55 What are some of the stories you remember growing up that really stood out in your mind in Lincolnwood [inaudible]- Kamran Hussain 25:59 Oh, man, I have so many stories. You know, me and Mark Youngstead, and then there was JJ Volchenbaum, who we all grew up with. We connected on Facebook maybe 10 years ago. And then we just had a side chat session where we just kind of mentioned like every single story growing up. But I was just thinking about this as we were getting ready for this. You remember Gaybba- [laughs] Gaybba was a character. He probably was maybe, two, three years older than us. Maybe, maybe not. No one knows him. He's very mysterious. He was- you know now that I look back on it and gave it to someone I kind of admired. You know, he didn't really like school, he was kind of a misfit. Howard Lee 26:41 I think Gaybba was smoking in like, third grade. Kamran Hussain 26:44 Yeah. I think his cousin, Lucca, was driving to school in the eighth grade. [laughs] So Gaybba was hilarious. He'd get off on the same bus stop as me. He lived on the other side of Pratt. And he just hated school, he would get off the bus and he would just run home. Like a 100 meter dash sprint, just run home every single day. Funny thing about Gaybba was, if you remember in Lincoln Hall, we had square dancing or line dancing. Howard Lee 27:13 Yeah. Kamran Hussain 27:13 I hated it. I just didn't want to, I just never wanted to participate. Maybe I just, I didn't want to touch girl's hands or whatever, but it just kind of- I didn't realize why gym had to- we had to do square dancing in gym. Gaybba was also someone that hated square dancing. And he refused. And he once tried to get a teacher's note, like a parent note, to get him to be out of square dancing. And I don't think the teachers bought it. I don't think Mr. Lussier or Mr. Mao bought that excuse. So they made him square dance. So he came to school the next day with rubber gloves. [laughs] Because he didn't want to touch the girls hands. Oh, man. He was a character. I mean, there were a lot of funny things. How 'bout stories about you? Howard Lee 28:02 You know, well, we'll take a step back for a second. Kamran Hussain 28:06 Okay. Howard Lee 28:06 Do you remember any stores that kind of stick out in your mind about-? Kamran Hussain 28:10 Stores? Howard Lee 28:10 Yeah. Kamran Hussain 28:11 Oh, man, eighth grade to when we got into high school, I'd be able to ride my bike places. We'd go to West Coast Video all the time. Howard Lee 28:20 Oh, yeah. Kamran Hussain 28:21 And rent movies. West Coast video was, it's where the... where was it? Howard Lee 28:26 Well the- Kamran Hussain 28:27 It's right- it's where the library is. Howard Lee 28:28 Yeah, it's right down the street from the library where- originally it was Video King. And then Video King went out of business and it became West Coast Video. And then it moved over to where- Kamran Hussain 28:37 Where [inaudible]'s Furniture is. Howard Lee 28:39 I think of it as where the pet store is. But yeah. Kamran Hussain 28:43 Yeah, West Coast Video was a staple of Lincolnwood. And we'd go there to rent movies quite a bit. It was kind of a sleazy place, too. Howard Lee 28:53 I remember the owners. Kamran Hussain 28:55 I'm sure you did. [laughs] Howard Lee 28:57 Now did you and your family ever go out to eat in the neighborhood? Kamran Hussain 29:01 Not in the neighborhood. It's funny cuz we used to- Pizza Hut was the big family outing. And then one of our neighbors once got pizza from Lou Malnati's. Howard Lee 29:13 Oh, yeah. Kamran Hussain 29:13 When I was young. And me and my sisters were all kids then. And we were like, "Dude, what is this pizza with the sauce on top of the cheese?" Like, "What's going on here?" But ever since then, ever since we eat that, we've been getting Lou Malnati's like once a week. But yeah, as a family we honestly never went out that often. I mean, going out had to be a special occasion. Like a really special occasion. Howard Lee 29:38 Did you guys ever go out for Indian food? Or if you went out it was like, pizza? Kamran Hussain 29:42 Nah, not too often. My mom was a stay at home mom. So she basically, very traditional, so she basically cooked everyday. Howard Lee 29:51 Okay. Do you remember where your mom bought groceries? Kamran Hussain 29:54 Yeah. So Devon obviously is where a lot of Indians are. Now it's crazy, but back in the 80s it was still, you know, a couple different stores. Like Patel Brothers, which has become huge. Howard Lee 30:06 Which, on a side note, I didn't know that Susan Patel's parents owned Patel Brothers grocery store. Kamran Hussain 30:11 Yeah. Yeah, that's like a national company. So now, you know where the Toys R Us is in Niles, on Golf and Milwaukee- it used to be a Toys R Us. Howard Lee 30:18 Mm. Kamran Hussain 30:19 Right across the street from Golf Mill Mall. Toys R Us went out of business. But now it's a huge Patel Brothers store. So anyway, there was a lot of stores on Devon that would sell Indian food and stuff that was imported. Now, you don't have to go to Devon to get Indian food, you can go anywhere to get Indian groceries. It's all over the place. Howard Lee 30:41 You know, you had mentioned this before that your mom didn't really have a lot of interaction with other kids' parents. Do you have any sense of what your parents' experience was like growing up in, well, I mean, while you were growing up in Lincolnwood? Kamran Hussain 30:56 I have no idea. My parents were probably more insulated from the outside. From like, school culture that I was part of. My parents had no clue- I think they still have no clue- on how the school system works. They just wanted us to study. They didn't know how to do homework with us. They didn't know how to do anything with us. So they basically expected us to study the way they studied, which was basically independent. But they had their own social circle with the few Indians that lived in the area. And so that was their kind of social circle. Howard Lee 31:31 Okay. Kamran Hussain 31:33 But in terms of social circle with the school community, not really. Howard Lee 31:39 Well you'd mentioned that your dad was big into the mosque, where did you go to mosque? Kamran Hussain 31:45 So there's a mosque on Albany Park. It's called MCC. It's Muslim Community Center. It's on Elston Avenue. Funny story about that is that Jason Trolovich's dad owned a company or worked for a company called Heart Electric. Howard Lee 32:01 Okay. Kamran Hussain 32:01 Which is actually right down the street from the mosque. So that was about four miles away from us. It wasn't too far from our house. So we would go- my dad was heavily involved with that. And we would go there for evening schools and Sunday schools. Howard Lee 32:19 Okay. Then you play'd basketball there as well? Kamran Hussain 32:23 No, so there was- so then in the late 80s and early 90s, that same mosque bought a building in Morton Grove. And that had a gym that we would go play basketball with on Friday nights. Howard Lee 32:33 Okay. Kamran Hussain 32:34 Yeah. Howard Lee 32:34 So, I'd mentioned at the start that you went to Todd Hall, you went to Rutledge Hall, you went to Lincoln Hall, you went to Niles West. Kamran Hussain 32:40 Yeah. Howard Lee 32:40 What were some of the teachers that kind of stand out in your mind? Kamran Hussain 32:43 Oh, man, there was a lot. I mean, I can name all my teachers. Miss Micucci was preschool. Miss Barker, not many people remember her. Miss Wicks, she was awesome. Miss Kistra was an all time favorite. Miss Yokes, fifth grade. Miss Rudnik, sixth grade. Miss Kasper who's now, Dr. Mao, I think? She married Mr. Mao. Mr. Mao was our gym teacher. And Mr- Howard Lee 33:11 That astounds me, by the way. Kamran Hussain 33:13 Well, you know, I think they had a little fling. [laughs] When we were in school. Kamran Hussain 33:18 I remembered that that was [inaudible]. Kamran Hussain 33:19 And then a few years later, we found out her name was Mrs.- my sister was in school there. And she was like, "Yeah, I have Mrs. Mao for social studies." I'm like "Mrs. Mao?" And then I'm like, "Oh, yeah, they got married." And still happily married. Good for them. Howard Lee 33:31 Yeah. Good for them. Kamran Hussain 33:32 Yeah. Mr. Mao, Mr. Lethy, Miss Fugate where our gym teachers. You know, Mr. Zyks was the vice principal. Howard Lee 33:42 We'll get to Zyks. Kamran Hussain 33:43 Okay, we'll get to Zyks in a little bit. Mr. Mao was our gym teacher. I don't know why I just never liked the guy. Not because he was a bad person, but there was just something that rubbed me the wrong way about him. And you know, he's probably a nice guy. But always in gym class, he'd always pick Sashi Mamba to do the demonstration of the drills. Howard Lee 33:47 Oh, yeah. Kamran Hussain 33:51 And it just really pissed me off. Howard Lee 34:01 Well, I mean, overall, did you- would you say that you had a positive experience with the teachers, they were good teachers? Kamran Hussain 34:11 Yeah, I think they were all pretty good teachers. I mean, I think there was some that I didn't like. But I think, from what I remember, Mrs. Wicks and Mrs. Kistra, I had really positive experiences. I think Mr. Lessing- eighth grade- I was getting a little bit more... You know, I was kind of becoming- getting into my own at that time. Miss Kistra- another good story about her was in the middle of the winter, my dad decides to take me to India. For two weeks. So I missed school for two weeks. And I come back and- so my dad gets gifts to give to my teachers- so I come back and I give a purse from India, a very traditional looking purse, to Miss Kistra. And I didn't realize Miss Kistra was kind of a hippie- Howard Lee 35:00 Hm. Kamran Hussain 35:00 -back then. [laughs] And I was so embarrassed to give it to her because I'm like "Oh, this [inaudible] India. It smells, it stinks, it's ugly. All these kids are gonna make fun of it because it's Indian. And she looked at it and like, she was almost in tears crying because she was so happy she got a gift from India. But I was kind of embarrassed to give it to her. Howard Lee 35:20 You didn't- did you ever have any sense of racism on any part of the teachers? Or ever get a sense that you were treated differently by any of the teachers? Kamran Hussain 35:33 Um, no. I mean, I remember back in the day- even like, friends that I remember- I remember even Danny McCluskey once called me Gandhi. And it was just kind of random, you know. We were friends. But like, it was just so easy for them to call me Gandhi or, you know, make fun of me because I'm Indian. And then like, I remember I'd go tell my dad like, "Dude, they're calling me Gandhi". And my dad would be perplexed. He's like, "Yeah, so what? Gandhi was a great guy." I'm like, "Yeah, but-" I don't think he got it. The fact that, you know, calling someone Gandhi in the 80s was kind of a mean- In high school, once again, this goes to my insecurity- it would be me and Daruk played football freshman year. We were on the B-team. Howard Lee 36:16 [Inaudible]'s your cousin. Kamran Hussain 36:17 Yeah. So we were close family friends and stuff like that growing up. So we knew each other. We tried out for football, because that was a cool thing to do when you started freshman year. And, you know, we played football on the B-team. And the coach, he started calling me and- Howard Lee 36:34 Gustason? Kamran Hussain 36:35 No, no, no, his name was Lacom, I think. Coach Lacom. Howard Lee 36:37 Okay. Kamran Hussain 36:38 Gustason was cool. I had no problem- even though he was kind of racist, too. He was cool. He said a couple racist things, too. Howard Lee 36:47 Yeah, I actually- Kamran Hussain 36:47 Jimmy Ong. Howard Lee 36:47 I actually do remember that. Kamran Hussain 36:47 But I did call him out on that and he apologized. He called Jimmy Ong Jim Foo. Just for the hell of it. I mean, there was no reason why he called him. His name was Jimmy Ong, right? That's what you call- his name was Jim Feng Ong, right? Kamran Hussain 36:59 Jim Feng Ong, yeah. Kamran Hussain 37:00 But he just called him Jim Foo for whatever reason. Now when I'm looking back at it I'm like, "That's kind of racist". And I remember I did tell him that. And then he got he kind of got startled by it and he was like, "No, I wasn't trying to be racist". But anyway, freshman year football. We just started freshman year. So high school is something new to us. It's in the summer. And the coach Lecom started calling me and Daruk 7-11. Howard Lee 37:22 Mm. Kamran Hussain 37:23 And, you know, people giggled about it and stuff like that. And you know, and he kept calling us that. And like I said, once again, with our insecurities, we were new to the school, all the other kids were new to us, except the kids that went to Lincoln Hall. And you know, we didn't say anything. And like I said, that's a difference that I'm glad that my son and my kids are taken differently. I mean, if someone calls my kid- just accidentally mispronounces the name- he corrects them. And he did get pissed off about that a couple times when it happened. So I was insecure as a kid and I just let it go, just because I didn't want to start controversy about it. Howard Lee 37:59 Right. Kamran Hussain 38:00 But, you know, calling- you know, in high school, and a high school teacher- coach- calling someone's two kids 7-11. I mean, dude, if I was older I would have done something about it at my time, right? Howard Lee 38:14 Well, let me ask you. You'd mentioned Zyks, before and you know, as I'm sitting here, I'm actually thinking another big story from, regarding school when we were kids, was Mr. Schultz. Mr. Schultz, the art teacher when we were in Rutledge Hall. He- a letter got sent home to all the parents that one of the teachers had been diagnosed as having AIDS. Kamran Hussain 38:35 Yeah. Howard Lee 38:35 And Mr. Schultz disappeared from school shortly before that. And then obviously, the big story when we were in high school was that Mr. Zyks, the Vice Principal of Lincoln Hall, was arrested for child molestation. Kamran Hussain 38:48 Well Mr. Zyks was arrested when we were in junior high. Because it was on the news. Howard Lee 38:53 Yeah, okay. Kamran Hussain 38:54 He left when we were still in junior high, but then he got arrested soon after that. Howard Lee 39:03 Okay. Kamran Hussain 39:04 Probably had something to do with it. Howard Lee 39:05 So what are your memories- Kamran Hussain 39:05 And the reason why he got arrested was I think he went to another school and got busted for the same thing. Howard Lee 39:05 Okay. Well, so what were your memories of Mr. Schultz? When were younger and then Mr. Zyks when we were a little bit older? Kamran Hussain 39:05 Mr. Schultz was actually a really good art teacher. Howard Lee 39:05 Oh, I loved Mr. Schultz. Mr. Schultz was by far my favorite teacher of all time. Kamran Hussain 39:13 But you know, it's funny, because I didn't know what being gay or homosexual was, you know, when I was that young. But I knew that he was a little bit different. I knew that, you know- when I look back at it I'm like, "Oh, it kind of all made sense". Right? But he was awesome. I just remember him being a really good art teacher. Howard Lee 39:31 Yeah, he was good [inaudible]. Kamran Hussain 39:32 And some of the things that I remember learning, I still remember, in our class that he used to do. And he was such a nice guy. When did he pass away? Probably- we were still in junior high or after that. Howard Lee 39:46 Yeah, yeah. Kamran Hussain 39:46 Yeah. So, this is kind of in the 80s when AIDS was a huge thing at that time. But I just remember him being- You know, the funny thing is, that when things happen in the 80s and 90s, you realize it now you're like, "Oh, that might have been a little inappropriate". I remember once- you know those, they had these little art things with little paper that you lick and it would stick. Howard Lee 40:10 Okay. Kamran Hussain 40:10 It was just like little string paper or whatever. Howard Lee 40:14 Okay. Kamran Hussain 40:14 And you'd lick and you stick and you'd make decorations on poster board or whatever. Okay, and for once he licked it and sticked it on a kid's butt [laughs]. But I remember that, it still sticks with me, but it was just kind of funny. Howard Lee 40:25 What are your memories of the whole Zyks incident? Kamran Hussain 40:29 Yeah. So funny thing about Mr. Zyks was- Howard Lee 40:33 Everyone- he was like, the cool principal. Everybody wanted to- Kamran Hussain 40:36 He was Mr. Cool principal. So the two things about Mr. Zyks was that he was always considered the cool principal. I remember, I was at Daruk's house, he lived right by Todd Hall. And it was really weird. It was a Saturday, I was just hanging out at his house. Our family were friends- our families were friends. So I'd hang out his house a lot, sleep over at his house once in a while. One day, someone threw eggs at the door. And that happened. And then, this is a Saturday afternoon, mind you. And then Dar's dad went outside and tried to chase the kid- it was a kid that threw it out, right? It was just probably some kid doing a stupid prank, right? I don't think it was anything racially motivated or whatever, right? Because the kid that did it was Filipino. So anyway, three hours later, Mr. Zyks comes with the kid to the house. And he made the kid apologize to Dar and his family. Which, you know, it happened, whatever, no big deal. But then like when you think about it, like, dude, why is the vice principal coming to a kid's house on a Saturday afternoon with another kid? Right. And anyway, that that happened or whatever. And the funny story is that we used to talk about this even when this was going on. Howard, you had a little incident with Mr. Zyks as well, back in school, you know, for some reason you lived in the Lincolnwood Towers, which is close to Devon. And you used to somehow, you know, this is back when they had newsstands, used to somehow be able to get access and buy playboys. So why don't you tell us about that story? Howard Lee 42:17 We don't have to get into that. But- Kamran Hussain 42:21 Anyway. Well, you'd sell them to other kids in school, right? You'd buy 'em, and then you'd sell them at a higher price to kids and you got busted. And it's kind of funny, but like, nothing happened to you. You didn't get detention, you didn't get after school detention or get in trouble. You just gotta let off the hook, which is kind of interesting. Howard Lee 42:41 Yeah. Well, do you have any remembers of when you know, Mr. Zyks got arrested there was the ensuing trial? I think, at that point, we were probably- when the trial happened I think we were freshmans in high school, I think. Kamran Hussain 42:53 No, I don't have any memories of that. It just kind of- so I didn't know Mr. Zyks that well. I don't think he even knew me. I just knew him, of him, because he's our vice principal. I don't think any of the principals actually even knew who I was. Howard Lee 42:53 Okay. Kamran Hussain 42:53 I didn't have him. I mean, I think in high school, the only person that I know, remember, is when David Chereck got murdered. Kamran Hussain 43:12 Oh, yeah. Kamran Hussain 43:13 And just recently, they convicted his killer. Howard Lee 43:17 Right, right. And you actually run into his mom around, time to time. Kamran Hussain 43:19 Yeah, it was kind of funny, his mom used to be a nurse with my dad. So- Howard Lee 43:24 Oh, wow, I didn't know that. Kamran Hussain 43:25 So it just so happened that I ran into her maybe about 10, 15 years ago, right after my dad passed away. And then we kind of kept in touch ever since. And she would tell me about the stories about what happened and the guys that were with him and how they were treated by the, you know, the detectives and stuff like that. But I'm glad that you know, she, you know- he was adopted. And you know, her husband died recently, a few years ago. Kamran Hussain 43:48 Oh, wow. Kamran Hussain 43:49 So that was their only child. And you know, it's been- and she would be at the court case every time that the person that was convicted- when he got arrested. Howard Lee 44:03 He actually just got convicted. I think he just got convicted a month or two ago. Kamran Hussain 44:06 A few months ago. Yeah, yeah. So that's one thing we keep in touch about, yeah. Howard Lee 44:12 Okay, so my last question would be, you know, mentioned earlier, that you currently live in Wilmette with your wife and your kids. Was that a conscious decision? Or did you ever consider raising your kids in Lincolnwood? And if you did, or didn't, I mean, is that something you feel like would be a positive one? Howard Lee 44:31 Yeah. Yeah, I mean, we were looking around for homes. We wanted to stay obviously near the north side. My mom lives, you know, my mom's a widow now. And so I wanted to be close to my mom. You know, if she ever needs me. But we were looking. We actually were looking at a home that one of our friends used to live in in The Towers. And it was kind of cool because it was listed and I was looking at it and then I really realized it was one of our friends homes. And- Howard Lee 45:03 Which friend? Kamran Hussain 45:03 Do you know Javin and Pravez Siddiqui? Howard Lee 45:06 Yeah! Kamran Hussain 45:07 Yeah. So they lived right by you. Howard Lee 45:08 Okay. Kamran Hussain 45:09 They're literally maybe three blocks away from you, right? Howard Lee 45:12 Okay. Kamran Hussain 45:13 On Sauganash. And the house is totally renovated. Has totally- it's amazing. Their house when they used to live in is very like 70s. Howard Lee 45:21 Okay. Kamran Hussain 45:21 Kind of like a swingers 70s house. Howard Lee 45:23 Okay. Kamran Hussain 45:14 Colorful basement and stuff like that. But this house was totally renovated. It's a really nice house, but just kind of way out of our price range. But yeah, we were looking at Lincolnwood. My wife teaches at Niles West, and she actually wants her kids to go to Niles West because of how diverse the school is. And you know, we found a house in Wilmette. So we're living there right now, but definitely not out of the realm of possibilities of moving back to Lincolnwood. Howard Lee 45:24 Okay. Kamran Hussain 45:24 But we're happy where we're at. It's funny because Wilmette and its school reminds me of the way Lincoln Hall and Rutledge Hall was when we were growing up. Howard Lee 45:24 Okay. Kamran Hussain 45:28 In terms of its racial diversity. The only difference is my kid, my kids, are a lot more secure in their upbringing than I was when I was a kid. Kamran Hussain 46:06 And what would you attribute that to, you think? Kamran Hussain 46:16 Uh, you know, I think I was embarrassed that my parents, you know, had an accent. They were more traditional. I'm not saying that I'm cool. [laughs] Definitely not cool, but- Howard Lee 46:26 [laughs] You definitely shouldn't say that. Kamran Hussain 46:28 You know, I was born and raised here. So, I was embarrassed. I would never ask my parents to come to a field trip with me. My kids, they want me to go. I don't really want to go. But I think they're probably just more secure. I mean, I think being insecure, though, when you're growing up, I think I kind of take that as a positive. Because it did make me feel a little bit more distinct and different. And- which is always a good thing. Sometimes I feel with my kids is that, you know, they have assimilated well, which is a good thing. But I kind of still want them to know that, you know, hey, they're still- maybe, not necessary in a bad way, but they're different. You know, they might be different. You know, whether it be a different- I think they know that. But they have a lot more confidence in how they interact with their classmates, their teachers, and even just having us around. Kamran Hussain 46:26 Okay, yeah. Well, I think that wraps it up for My Lincolnwood Story. Kamran, is there anything else you'd like to say? Kamran Hussain 47:06 No, I'm glad that you were able to interview me. Me and Howard have known each other since 1982 maybe, right? When you started second grade? '82? Howard Lee 47:43 Yeah, '82, '83? '84, something like that. Kamran Hussain 47:44 Yeah, '83. And we've been friends ever since. He came to my wedding. Howard's not married, but I went to a sister's wedding. Howard Lee 47:55 Oh, yeah, that's right. Kamran Hussain 47:56 His uh- Howard Lee 47:58 I went to your sister's wedding actually. Kamran Hussain 47:59 You went to my sister's wedding. And you know, we've been friends since. Petty cool. Howard Lee 48:06 All right, thanks. Kamran Hussain 48:07 Cool. https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/bc5dfefb0b0ed0a3627e7e3b8b5e6c0a.jpeg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=r5fk1NpRuFIOkR5FdmR7Jq%7E8nrgM4v0K98%7EuVi24Wc9WQI9RaTqB6MtK4ZyCITcf9fyGIU1veQ8nadto28SqB6ngVyTfs%7EUIcB90gautRv2e6WY%7EcS8kUu3Ont%7E65hm6yFZJtIGEOkPHAsIYJ6eI0loriQ4qYOnePVLSnHDlYUGe8ht641LDPX-53-hEJ-FTjq28jaLezVs3MeHzTbKydjl8PY3C7kjeNohSg4rwE4u4OrOsPcD2IfNNIpGrePpSmCQ%7EjJE3tKZlfnOERY3FEAdgQdvHmAXtWli34nHhpovx-jJ4FVBxa0xYjAHE16-uRxI2BMR5aBwFiw01iqgm-A__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM bf49cf7c121529f7fa624bc6ce5854bb Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Chuck and Lawrence Miller https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/11191d524f51f86157fa256f66189eee.mp3?Expires=1781740800&Signature=AQnc4KnYL2WV7i6gRQMPh001W8YLpZ56fb0NxnK8ojXfH9P-KOLzFWoUkKiRoWNDs08-fwuJIqhEj%7EdRkUwvCL2Q0dcnkm1NZdNAikiYTe2TPc55KUQVOmAz-6LTsz91u2VkhqGuu1BL2U-dTGA2xBrYI2VCW7tSomGUpD-rFrxXhM%7EIRUbpyE8sWTIqidHgE%7Emfcw8Zqzq31AgjvkHX4fuoR2iNO5e4T4e%7E2G97GCeUdrJ0LxZWyUuwW3rLidwmNvhz9NMcBIPLT8V8EAFzQ86zEdtJmAF7KxPmuJbi93LXJmBKEEenvxMtKyhQO1tQWF55YfRhylEyPPxVoMdN1g__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 4faf4394bb4bca5d6a368242e8b6ff03 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Lawrence H. Miller https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/e8927240fef23f6a1e1bb2d08ea3d0f7.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=Rhh3ScYpCjSMJKw0lhbpsD9w6msSvo3OyadDDJZ96uvYpwgzeAZvx0DyEKhzcaoaoDtc6wrodo%7EXYUqy1i7bsjC-6CKA2DQD17kXJXQTBoGHW5GdZIRqzhR6SM-X4h901jv1jZcm00p78p7tPMfZ7JsmVAUn6L5mDVzPnup1VmfZFjsCssna5xXW0MDzvNTu4unXP7rHcOnDwbGxqMr4IPGM4JYC9UiBhj5Cw7wkaXCJpcBHDpztfjdaNM-RPZOUwTRyFXklwuUrQ8jMPN9qHpaaJd%7E%7E9lY4OR6qJN%7EgFm6cEZQXuNSN3e-2xJVh2%7ERWCA3xIaEjAZYYv3w05sbs%7Eg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 181be2c03c096c9fd6cb3bf0e53b8ee2 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Mr. Miller’s father (left), Charles, with his siblings, (l-r) Catherine Miller, Fred Miller, Clara Blameuser, Henry Miller, Marie Miller, June 1955 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/9edc2a33f0949f6f459de9fc05784e92.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=sz2IwvLlAnGmw8NkI8xO0shF-d7aPvhrtph4DD1QYqWfbqrAN-ABP6xcKf0RirVCN%7EOJO%7E77CWcDoS-P6X4MzESF7tBxzBywT4Pwpm%7EjPKohReUu-XQTruXEXKjfTT5njVummWU0OPhXFtvmoxdORMU3UjdIxANdSXDzEdO7zg62Ravop7DhN%7E5Jo8o8KawZQuQZdSUKdKqGLfX7mQKf9Pz6NIaTT3pokMllfNTptk-Azt60TG1vuvew61AsBWbK0MxyufacMmq5Nq%7E8HoRFDmQ5D9R1DsmsVsBTeWAqWUJ8NH5EfOXzM6lvSs7sY4hABSg5Ho4l6PqV9kiko6G%7Erg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 7c3c0a04f02f15794644515cd83ef9a7 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Mr. Miller’s grandfather, 1934 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/ff7c7cb3001bc3e11694e2f38f778830.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=rqzxgWYlzE9rn4A5cdYVPSC6wx4RJ-%7EtiQCjIhziLmfL31v2LYwjkBs7NwE2bYQuExHPWbsuehRLzXrTgNnnjR3O-2fpQ4GC20sTM-UVWOH0-xF6jCgDMWej9%7EY45m4wIzfJuZML2Slm3d7Wnr2mDP9psku56u6wHRcw9NV4Wfm%7EtUOtw3%7EyJ3Cifh7uliGCcl%7E94iZEtWxHyNP%7EDI-qJNENlS4uD%7EtAVcBmaODVn4%7ER6se02guKsfOeUrEHD6paV8A49nQGJhqZt7TYJdABAsAqQ8NM7fpAo0HE%7EUQe%7E4fuTM3bN58sCgffJqJWVVcCPdy50FGaK2VICu2STN5I9Q__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM e6aabef8bfae038d4f22a0f63092bdbc Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Mr. Miller’s wife, Ruth Oppice, 1942 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/86adfba09ccedc8d144ac0e0b4f8d869.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=vFotI-j5g9uFOkD2DcmzDrxcpVz4-GbCMVp%7EPkwL7AfsuGRS08FXxNHNy-fpIQYO-nbwQu5yTpG01McFk4F3-mPV6C48DFhiFnZGclARq8Yewq9j-TKGjz2T2nxbXLBvl2RKfBxl0wwNSmfErpMG4z0CJn61WzR0WxP-O4FNGumeZ7BeraBkjoaCL3FY2QuBiMkUovfywxf2Mh-JbhUVOXFrqRqFRJY3zh0PHlywxcT7gcOCm8eBXnK0dbWFkMiwmxxbULoHAVOTjdRGvRLn5RD8TX3qPxfClKhvGvEcONpjjRqEoMIGjQHG1joi6X2gBwjf6Kwdv3fIKNZcJULRJg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 31b9743b91868d1a447900378822d1c8 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Charles N. Miller Greenhouse, looking east. Touhy Ave on the far right, Chase Ave. in the center, 1930s Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Lawrence H. Miller Subject The topic of the resource “At the time, when I was there, the population of Tessville was 450.” Lawrence (Larry) H. Miller was born in Morton Grove and moved to Lincolnwood with his parents and siblings in 1925 to a house on Kostner Ave. and Chase Ave. In this interview, Mr. Miller talks about being in the first graduating class of Niles Township High School, coaching little league baseball, his background as a graphic artist and more. He is interviewed by his son, Chuck Miller. Click <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQsE2qn578c" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer noopener">here</a> to view footage of the construction of Lincolnwood School provided by Mr. Miller. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Chuck Miller 0:00 Good morning. This is Chuck Miller and my dad, Larry Miller. It's April 18, 2019. I am interviewing him about his time when he grew up and knew Lincolnwood and Tessville. So dad, can you tell me who was the first Miller in the family that came to Tessville before you? Larry Miller 0:24 The first one who came here was my grandfather, Henry Miller. And he built the house, and it had to be before 1900. Chuck Miller 0:41 You found records. Where was the house? Larry Miller 0:45 On Kostner Avenue, about 7241? I think North Kostner. And according to the Census Bureau -- in 1900 was Henry Miller, my grandfather, Clara, his wife, and three of his oldest children. The oldest one was Charles, my father, and then Henry and Clara. That was in the 1900 Census. Chuck Miller 1:23 All right. Now, was the house, you said, on Kostner, which was between Chase and Touhy. So just north of Touhy Avenue. Larry Miller 1:31 Yes. Chuck Miller 1:32 Okay. Chuck Miller 1:33 And you mentioned greenhouses. What can you tell the people what they mean by the greenhouses? He was in the greenhouse business. Larry Miller 1:43 Well, a greenhouse business was where growers -- they were wholesalers -- and the greenhouses were what they used. They were a unit. Each unit was called a house, together it was the greenhouses, and they totaled 66,000 square feet. Chuck Miller 2:10 Wow. Okay. That was quite a big greenhouses setup then. Larry Miller 2:15 I think so. Chuck Miller 2:16 Okay. Now, when he built that -- your grandfather, or when he was there -- he wasn't actually the builder. But he was out there working the land to get it ready for somebody to build. Is that correct, or --? Larry Miller 2:32 My father and another man, who handled a horse, did most of the leveling of the ground, preparing for the builders when they came in. Chuck Miller 2:45 And then when it was all built, your father and brothers bought the house? They bought the greenhouse and everything from them? Larry Miller 2:56 My dad and his two brothers bought the greenhouses from my grandfather. And they were now the owners of -- at that time was called Miller Brothers Greenhouses or Miller Brothers Florist. Chuck Miller 3:15 But then sometime later your father bought out your brothers. Larry Miller 3:20 My dad was drafted -- went into the army in 1917 -- [during] World War I, and came out in '18. Shortly after that my two uncles decided to sell to my dad, and they went into a different business. So somewhere around that time, my dad purchased the greenhouses from his two brothers. Chuck Miller 3:49 Okay. I think you had told me at one time you were born in Morton Grove. Larry Miller 3:58 I was born in Morton Grove because when my dad came back from service, my uncle Fred had the house next to the greenhouses. My dad and mom rented a house in Morton Grove. And my sister, who was born in 1920, was born in Morton Grove, and I was born in Morton Grove also. Shortly after that, about 1925 or thereabout, my folks moved into the house that my uncle Fred had originally built when they bought the greenhouses from their two brothers. Chuck Miller 4:43 Now, when you lived in what was then Tessville, do you remember what the population was? Larry Miller 4:51 At the time when I was here in a population of Tessville was 450. Chuck Miller 4:55 [laughs] Okay. And a lot of a lot of policemen and people would take care of the town? Larry Miller 5:05 Yes, we had one policeman. His name was Lawrence Shea. I don't know how you spell it, if it was S-H-E-A or S-H -- I think that's the way it was spelled. Chuck Miller 5:18 You were telling me he used to do something every summer for the kids in Tessville. Larry Miller 5:25 Every summer they had Tessville day, which was an all day party in a park, or sort of park, next to where Henry Proesel, the mayor's house was. Lawrence Shea, the chief, would make the rounds of all the homes in Tessville that had children and give each of them five free tickets to Tessville Day. These tickets were worth five cents apiece. But they were good for pop, or hotdog, or whatever. Chuck Miller 6:07 You told me you remember a big fire back in the day. It was at Becker Box Company or Beaker? Larry Miller 6:18 Yes, Becker Box Company was located on Lincoln Avenue just east of Touhy. It was quite a large box factory, all wood. And when that burned, it was quite a tremendous fire. Chuck Miller 6:37 And what building then came there later? Larry Miller 6:45 The building that you're referring to, I think, was the restaurant and so forth at Lincoln and Touhy, that later on was the Purple Hotel. And I can't remember the name of the restaurant, but that burned also - it was quite a fire. Quite a few fire departments in the area were there for that one. Chuck Miller 7:15 Now, when you were growing up, you went to school in what was called Niles Center. Larry Miller 7:22 [overlapping] That's correct -- Chuck Miller 7:23 Which later became Skokie. Larry Miller 7:25 Right. Chuck Miller 7:26 Okay. You told me you remember the first Tessville school bus? And there was something unique about that? Larry Miller 7:37 First of all, I think that Tessville school bus was really the first school bus for the area around there. It was, I remember, green and wicker seats. In fact, if I want to go further, double seat on the left and a single seat on the right, Chuck Miller 7:58 Okay. Larry Miller 7:58 It's my memory of the Lincolnwood school bus. Now, that took care of East Prairie School in Tessville and also St. Peter's Catholic School in Skokie; at that time was Niles Center. Chuck Miller 8:16 Right. Okay. You went to high school. You said you spent a year at St. Gregory's High School and then you transferred after that. Larry Miller 8:32 I transferred my sophomore year into the brand new Niles Township East High School. So I was in actually in the first graduating class from Niles East. Chuck Miller 8:48 Okay. And in your senior year, you met somebody there who you got to be close to for quite a while. Larry Miller 8:59 Well, I met Ruth Oppice. We dated a few times. At that time, when you got out of high school, you could anticipate going into service and so it's 1942. So, I was in service from '42 to '46. And after I came back from service, we got together again and got married in 1948. Chuck Miller 9:31 Okay, and married quite a few years, as I recall. Larry Miller 9:37 Fifty-six. Chuck Miller 9:38 Fifty-six, holy cow! That's not very common nowadays. But congratulations on that. Larry Miller 9:44 Thank you. Chuck Miller 9:46 I think I was there some of the time. Larry Miller 9:50 I believe you were. Chuck Miller 9:53 And then you moved into a house in Lincolnwood in, what - 1953? Larry Miller 10:00 I think that was -- I'm not -- Chuck Miller 10:02 Somewhere around there. That's when I was born in '53. Larry Miller 10:07 Okay, you were born in '53 then it was a couple of years later -- no, it was right after you were born when we moved there, yeah. Chuck Miller 10:20 Okay. In one of your notes, you told me that there was something interesting that all the houses in Lincolnwood had to have. Larry Miller 10:29 Well, at that -- Chuck Miller 10:30 [overlapping] Which I hated. Larry Miller 10:31 At that time the rules were when you built a house, a house had to have an incinerator in the basement, so that you could burn your garbage and trash because they didn't have garbage pickup at that time. So every basement had an incinerator and that's where you put your newspapers in, whatever food stuff we weren't using went into the incinerator in hope it burned completely. Chuck Miller 11:07 One of the things I remember you telling me about was there was a place at Lincoln and Devon that you used to go to that was a root beer stand. Larry Miller 11:20 I don't think anything like that could ever exist now. It was a root beer stand and the price of root beer was 5 cents a glass. Now, the important thing was when you got a glass, you had to wait until all the foam settled because otherwise you couldn't drink more than one. But you hung out and it was an unusual situation, I think. Chuck Miller 11:49 Well, an interesting sidebar to that, at Lincoln and Devon, there was a bowling alley at some time, across there called Devlin. Larry Miller 12:03 Devon Lincoln. Chuck Miller 12:06 Now the sidebar is, my wife's grandfather owned that bowling alley. She lived in Morton Grove, but we have some photos. There was a photo that shows her grandfather's greenhouse, which was about eight blocks away from the greenhouse where you grew up. Larry Miller 12:28 That was the Fortman's Greenhouse. Chuck Miller 12:32 So when you had the house and Lincolnwood what would be like your fondest -- was there a fondest memory or something of the house or the neighborhood that you would pass on to people, something that you really liked about it? Larry Miller 12:49 Well I liked the house and I liked the area. Across the street, directly across the street from me, was a small park which was about maybe 90 feet in width. The kids in the neighborhood used to play ball in there and if we didn't watch them, they would get a league ball and -- Chuck Miller 13:14 [overlapping] Smack some windows -- Larry Miller 13:16 -- a couple of times I went out in front of the house and played left field not by their request but to protect my picture window in the living room. Chuck Miller 13:29 This house was on Kildare, which was also between Touhy and Chase, and still there. Larry Miller 13:36 Yes, still there. Chuck Miller 13:37 The park is still there. I've driven by there and it's twice as small looking as it was when I used to play there. Larry Miller 13:43 Oh, it's a beautiful park, you know. Chuck Miller 13:48 But other than that, yes, I thought it was a very nice, quaint neighborhood, something you would always see in a TV movie. And one of the things I remember is when I would ride my bike down the street, it was always very shady. The trees grew over and it was just this beautiful tree lined street. And then at some point later something came in and took care of all that and changed it forever. Larry Miller 14:19 Well, and during the Depression years, Mayor Proesel hired a lot of young fellows who are unemployed and they build and planted elm trees throughout all of Lincolnwood -- or Tessville, I think it was Lincolnwood by that time. And this would have been just a beautiful -- every street covered with trees, curb to curb. Later on Dutch Elm disease came in and everything was cut down and destroyed because of the Dutch Elm disease. So we lost all the trees that would have been just beautiful. Chuck Miller 15:20 You noted something about Fourth of July with fireworks or fireworks stands. Larry Miller 15:28 Well, at Touhy, and, you might say at Touhy and Kostner was a great old place called the Kenilworth Inn. And next to that was always -- maybe two or three weeks before Fourth of July -- would be a firework stand and across the street at tullian Lincoln was another firework stand. Now, the Kenilworth Inn was a bar and many of the slightly inebriated people from the bar would start shooting off fireworks for a couple of weeks before Fourth of July near our house, which was just a block away. We heard much, much fireworks at that time. Chuck Miller 16:31 And then I think years later the big empty lot over there that was right off Touhy and Lincoln became a driving range for golf. Or a lot of years later, I think. Larry Miller 16:43 It would have been really if Kostner had gone through it. We would hit the old Kenworth in which was still there at that time and just to the east of it was a golf driving range for a couple of years. That's long gone. Chuck Miller 17:03 And then Kenilworth moved, kind of accross the street. Larry Miller 17:07 Kenilworth was torn down and a new one was built across the street and that building is still there. I'm trying to think -- Chuck Miller 17:17 [overlapping] I don't know if it's L Woods or -- Larry Miller 17:21 Yeah, I'm not sure the name now. Chuck Miller 17:25 And I think your dad used to be a patron of the old Kenilworth in the evenings sometimes, because he had to do something over at the greenhouse. Larry Miller 17:35 Well, some times the greenhouse used to have a fireman, which stayed through the night to make sure that the boilers were going and temperature was up or you would lose the entire crop. And during the war years it was difficult to find someone to do that sort of work and my dad would go over and stoke the boilers and then maybe late evenings go over to the Kenilworth and sit for an hour or two with the owner and have a few drinks and come back about two in the morning and restoked the boilers again until the crew came in early on next morning. Chuck Miller 18:33 Now during the time that you were in Lincolnwood you knew of, I think, one mayor? Larry Miller 18:40 Well it was one mayor that started, I think, before I was there and was still mayor years and years after. I don't know how many years. Henry Proesel was mayor of Lincolnwood Chuck Miller 18:57 You were pretty good friends with him? Larry Miller 19:00 Well -- Chuck Miller 19:00 [overlapping] or you knew of them or everybody knew everybody? Larry Miller 19:03 We knew the family and I knew his son and daughter. I knew Henry also. Chuck Miller 19:11 And your father knew him obviously from being on the school board. Larry Miller 19:16 I'm not sure. I think my dad might have been on the village board but I'm not sure. I know later on he was on the school board. Chuck Miller 19:28 Someone else that knew him was your father in law. Because when your wife, when mom, Ruth Oppice, moved to Lincolnwood, and then when you guys got married later, her father lived in Lincolnwood. Off of Pratt and Kilpatrick over there. Larry Miller 19:48 Yeah, Kilpatrick. Chuck Miller 19:49 I know he was pretty good friends with Mayor Proesel. Larry Miller 19:53 I think he was on the village board also. He was also, I'm trying to think of what year that would have been, about 1951 or so. He was president of the American Dental Association. [inaudible] the first before that president of the Chicago Dental Association, and then later the American Dental Association. Chuck Miller 20:31 When you lived in Lincolnwood, you belonged to a few groups or organizations. You were in American Legion. You are a member of the Legion, right? Larry Miller 20:44 American Legion had a very nice building there, a nice post. In fact, I think, you worked there part time. Chuck Miller 20:57 I worked there part time. Yes. For some weddings and dances and stuff. But it was quite a -- you had a big group of members, I think, in there, didn't you? Larry Miller 21:10 Yeah. Chuck Miller 21:12 And then later on I remember you helping out with coaching in Lincolnwood when they had Little League. I mean, I remember having you as a coach one year. Larry Miller 21:23 Yeah. Well, your older brother Tom, was the first one in little league from our family. And you were the second and I was an assistant coach, I think, at that time. As I recall from that, our coach used to get in some unusual spats with other coaches and the rules finally came out that he was not allowed to step across the foul line. And if there was any discussion or description or discretion going on, I was to take his place because if he crossed the line, we forfeited the game. Chuck Miller 22:10 I know who the coach was, but I'll refrain from naming them [laughs] for posterity. In case one of his children happens to hear any of this. You noted something about Lincolnwood fastpitch softball. What was that? Larry Miller 22:27 Well, that was a softball league that had teams from -- we had one from Lincolnwood, there were a couple of them from Skokie, and a couple from Morton Grove. And these [players] were mostly from about 18, 25, 30 years old, something like that. That league dissolved during the war, and then after we came back from service, it continued for a couple more years. Chuck Miller 22:58 Now, fastpitch and slowpitch are two different things. So what is the difference? Larry Miller 23:04 Fastpitch was a 12 inch ball and slowpitch was a 16 inch and very slow. The pitch had to have an arc on it. Fastpitch was as fast as the pitcher could throw it. Chuck Miller 23:24 I think now you'll see sometimes in Hollywood, the celebrities will play softball. They all were mitts. Now they're playing 16 inch with a mitt. Chicago is, I think, is the only area where they do not wear mitts to play 16 inch softball. Larry Miller 23:41 Well, Chicago was about the only place where 16 inch slowpitch was played. I played one season there. No, we never use mitts for 16 inch softball. Chuck Miller 23:58 When you lived in Lincolnwood, you worked where? You worked in Chicago, right? In a number of places. Larry Miller 24:08 Yeah. And studio in Evanston, and then downtown Chicago. Chuck Miller 24:15 Well, you were on Michigan Avenue. Larry Miller 24:23 Michigan and -- Chuck Miller 24:24 Wacker. Larry Miller 24:25 Wacker. Right. Chuck Miller 24:26 Which is now a hotel. Larry Miller 24:28 Yes. I think it was the Stone Container building. Chuck Miller 24:32 The old Stone Container building, which moved years later. And the type of work that you did, I remember growing up, you had pencils from when you had your studio and it said "advertising art". And then years later it was transferred to really be called graphic arts. You know, you grew up as a graphic artist. Larry Miller 24:57 That was it. Yeah. Chuck Miller 24:59 And you went to school. You went to art school in Chicago. Larry Miller 25:03 Chicago Academy of Fine Arts. Chuck Miller 25:08 That's where Walt Disney went. Larry Miller 25:09 Oh. I didn't -- Chuck Miller 25:11 He wasn't in your classes there. Larry Miller 25:12 [overlapping] He wasn't there. No. Chuck Miller 25:13 [laughing] Okay. You stayed in Lincolnwood and then you finally moved out in - what was that about? 1986? Something like that? Larry Miller 25:26 I can't -- don't recall it the year. Chuck Miller 25:35 Since then you've driven by the old neighborhood a few times to see how it looks and everything. I'm sure you're going to say things changed a little bit? Larry Miller 25:47 Well, after we sold the house, those people who bought the house resold some years later, and it was enlarged quite a bit. From the outside appears to be the same. But inside it was enlarged and improve quite a bit. Chuck Miller 26:18 What would you think was the biggest change from when you grew up in Lincolnwood to when you left Lincolnwood? And now that you're been away from there, what do you think was the biggest change that you've noticed? If anything? Just the population or -- ? Larry Miller 26:39 Well, the population for certain I don't know what the population is now. Chuck Miller 26:45 Probably 470 now or something? If it was 450 back then it's probably grown alot. Okay. Oh, because when I drive back, I look and I notice it's a town of Walgreens, I think. There seems to be a Walgreens at every corner. But yes, it's grown a lot over the years. I don't know. I know you said your favorite memory was that, you know, it was a pretty town and you really liked the quaintness. Was there anything else about Lincolnwood that, you know, [is there] one thing you could say about Lincolnwood? Larry Miller 27:25 Well, it always seemed to be a very well kept, clean town. And as the years progressed, I think there were almost every lot was filled with homes. So very seldom did you find a vacant lot around Lincolnwood after many years, Chuck Miller 27:50 As opposed to when you were growing up, looking at the pictures that you gave me. It was pretty empty. And I remember when I was growing up, there were a lot of empty lots, which were fun for us, because we would go play in the construction sites of houses, but you'd get in trouble. Yeah, but one of the things I recall people telling me about Lincolnwood was years ago the taxes were reasonable. And if they needed certain services they would get them from other communities. Like, before they had a fire department, it was Chicago and Skokie. They would just call them when they needed them and paid per -- Larry Miller 28:20 Yes. Chuck Miller 28:38 But then since then they've got their own Fire Department. More than one policeman now. Larry Miller 28:46 Yes. Chuck Miller 28:50 Were there any businesses in Lincolnwood that you, you know, have fond memories of? Oh, I really like this place or that place? Or I remember the little grocery store that used to be on Touhy by Keystone. There was Linwood, I think was when I was there. Larry Miller 29:08 It was an IGA grocery. That was about the first large grocery store in Lincolnwood. Chuck Miller 29:20 Now did you know the people that owned that, or -- Larry Miller 29:23 No, not the IGA. There was a very small grocery shop, you might say, prior to that, we knew those people, but that was just very small. Chuck Miller 29:53 You remember the two hardware stores in Lincolnwood? They were both Touhy Avenue. Larry Miller 30:00 I just remember the one -- trying to think, I think I had a name? I don't recall the name. Chuck Miller 30:08 The one that was closer to Cicero or Skokie Boulevard had an interesting sign that would flash. It was called Sam the Hardware Man. Larry Miller 30:20 Right, Sam Lerner I think was his name. And there was a drugstore, a small drugstore next door to him. I can't remember -- well, we dealt with him. I can't remember his name. That was before the the giant Walgreens and so forth took over. Chuck Miller 30:46 And a couple of doors away, I remember, was the First Bank of Lincolnwood. Larry Miller 30:52 Well, First Bank of Lincolnwood was at Lincoln and Touhy. Chuck Miller 30:57 I thought it was right by the railroad tracks on Touhy. But maybe not. I remember the one at Lincoln and Touhy but I thought prior to that it was there but -- Larry Miller 31:08 Could be. Chuck Miller 31:10 You're kind of old. What do you know? Larry Miller 31:11 [overlapping] Yeah, I'm getting old now. Chuck Miller 31:13 And you do remember the Purple Hotel, which I always knew it as the Hyatt House. Larry Miller 31:22 I think the nickname always still prevails, they still refer to it as a Purple Hotel. Because it was purple. Chuck Miller 31:35 And over at the big Lincolnwood Park, as we called it, now it's Proesel Park, they used to have a day camp there. And I remember all of us kids going to the Lincolnwood day camp. Do you remember what the fee was for that? By any chance? Larry Miller 31:58 Gosh! I don't even remember if there was a fee? Was it $5? Chuck Miller 32:03 I think it was $5 a kid for the summer. I think the guy in charge was Mr. Gundy. I think he was a principal over at Lincolnwood School for a number of years. Just a big memory there. But yeah, it was quite a quite a park. Anything else you can think of that you want to pass on about your life growing up and Lincolnwood and spending a lot of time there? Larry Miller 32:38 I enjoyed my time there. I don't know what else to say. Chuck Miller 32:45 Would you move back? Larry Miller 32:47 Would I move back? At this time? At age 94? I don't think I would move back into a house. I'm in a condo now. Chuck Miller 33:01 Anything you would want to tell people about maybe if they thought about going to Lincolnwood or what they should look for? To say something to finalize your interview. Larry Miller 33:15 I would say if you're planning to go to Lincolnwood check with realtors and find out what's available. It's not going to be the same price as it was when I built there. Chuck Miller 33:33 But you had many happy years there and lots of good memories, it sounds like. I know I did. I want to thank you for coming here with me to take the time to do this interview. Larry Miller 33:45 Well, it was my pleasure. I'm sure. Chuck Miller 33:50 Well thank you again. https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/98c8e5de276bf148b27c648cf2d7f984.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=OyRFSdBZdkzWl%7Eg0cjDf8c49q0Aae1CH%7EvTwgaeu8oH0Mm1RKreBxrU5ZyxpxlRNCjf6BjZ%7EEt8jfD4q46tbcjwi0pu5spweSVc3zAse-w2eBGzExOA9j7glmdcaacAINeb21q2hXiJARwP4YTYccvA2xb2g745MbXnvtcqlTqJAu%7Etwjm6jf9qPNaKEfoYqDth5axtko5CjBjPLCOMRMgdNfEJOGHSv6J2rrv7Ad0BmozDlybFW7ZVoWDwODsVMK%7E6pOzKNSUsPH9JUz3lH5HW0E5PXiGn3jiCaIJhSKpNtA6B6CwnVOhJ17k0lhUEqkfBzvohKexRME4a7JeSVqw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 4bab3e89681f79b606c3df970cd5fd9c Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Marc Zissman https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/78d9308b86b976fe41707226523448bc.mp3?Expires=1781740800&Signature=tu0Fpweo4cjIsRHd5IAJ%7EFkjJj6-BZ0cNUkvR4hgQluqaqBe19pPQZR9o%7EUI7jJr3UwtXBYvGRoMBkZpTLVn3SBwFQWqLjCNEneiSm8xNrgbWMFZ4czsUdZJqo2rx7uiq2owmCyvjRu68Incr7tNbtYQffJfQRpUnxnq%7ET6HCmGvwYdMX9OJIuJRt%7EdRbYZBvr-C7lZn-PvXdIo56QyvMF9Xb0XtgpAmCOlln4Tr7q4SoXzO3ZLniXakmhKmEfehCbnpS4QdxPyR3lKJbUd8Uqi1ev9eNbDp0sZJflzm%7EQE3PvUPmmRQfgm46xPyOZjYHEiUXEKt8TAuwpWvRTmwfQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 4e96e5a7808a23c3dd5badb80e4bdd5e Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Marc Zissman https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/2f8446bc3818054f3a1a75e12a23c510.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=XuhpzLNsKMpyLEDgpjykQlKoR%7EhaAGRSzxJEc%7EdMuh9yQWuJuRBBBmeXi5akWujxvbVxUzfQJRfuxPH4p6O9ULXC0gMrgfAH8S9Vauu7JrV4LiiXX8ib-Fi7hmupX7RDjbaNGeZ551Dgwau5VFhFGcokkFXL%7EOSXePIOotLoiPGjMEe7rGYIg1mgX-KS-mWZ8iUdad21kTmmMQ6vQiNx-MYblNlRI0b4Q4TPCc1uYhvGFI0ik7Tqua0KJ0QFuD83w4Fcpl-4dpVf79D2LgJeYu3yjghlnEFOps7WjKFI3kH02%7EVYCc3tq15GvhnRsrGhPB%7EDfciY1QOuiTk78vQMFg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM eb6821d06054db8f9be9cd2133f41bdb Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource c. 1967/68. Marc at home at 6757 N Harding, top floor, looking out the window across Pratt towards Lincoln Hall https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/e967bdab8e4da910436ef59e8593a810.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=hwFiGPUI3BNcJuobQLozmulg9QJkmplsfbeNXZj2bOhyZ%7EuCM6oryZVm-EVLcjSvFV-vXtoiC7gyGTBT51vJPOeVO0YYTy%7E5RVcsUQyyhKKei42gCR7vOnPKRNIFo0xOQ9GjH2gQQ-c9xFEpCrExSRKxsSytrykGLeXewDOCQhpiFlhpK-JzV5-TQpdSrn4GNA9UDGvLfIUe63mRE4TzuJZn6iVqtc1uvWhM9-94SreVxe9qMPO-LLU5jksZQiV7Ks2PokjapRLeFRsYPI4j64U09CPaaq4GAga68fcBCDA7BU0VbIZLzKxJO3jUJidtKm4WICyqaJ1CCu2JbjnYGA__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 9a03b2658044e1287ea632cd64adcbff Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource 1974. Little league game at Proesel Park. Marc is batting https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/3cad9f1399d2960a155b62f53a461fa3.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=jQeNYc4JbysFuYO-DEkZD%7EeVxgCc53xZMRnB8O1JcCAsCGEmSyzOjEx72AaTqNGu60htZ2aCOGSijksFpzdgwDCAKMh8%7EedsSeDfJMb8CF6wygk4YATSwb%7EB9yTmhb72D-CA9MjD6PTrr7gL1HHBBtlbw67eP7h2EgyHjcEo7cKZI8Wiyom76gAzKTvzvZEyOTrh-DIOhI3fVZeWYRNFu28rPcqCvIzxeWURRT-VkSZ9n7IxyCthXqfJfygHpGMwRTruiWbBY624jlTal3n%7ERE7yzZT5BZyn0U2eABvNbsEpbXuMgSNJSMRzSLui5q2WV36bwGoj1ZLey8mLLSDyIg__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 33542a5d0c82fb45cbcfc4c47d345ec8 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Winter of 1973-74. Rutledge Hall. Marc is on the bottom right https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/21996/archive/files/bacde2c513f2c913b633ad005161354b.jpg?Expires=1781740800&Signature=MftI5tRtIa5trCpaszqOMYnt2E-6KbXwswLXv8O6qs8Qr14moqwsNBWd5fXaApGsEr4V0bguRh5Pn1wjDzU9Zl4uVvqpZFS9uGjfSqT3xa5ghs2Ql7XfH91oN55zr8zdh6ItMIi5Sls5DQiFxu09ATbZ9FuAJjGf9rdDKjzgPR5B%7Ec9mC5sp4zhHYVsY02VeJLL94X%7EB65YNmFyr6Lo-SwllVpmRTUizUm%7EVhaVW3sDXVrCPtclbCliama1mwM%7E6nmdjsz1vIKvBkY2VVbDah2NAJ1i3jRSbSMymR2l0jBwmj8xLfzQL2grucepjl7k1mSay68ywuse5FuTNsj8s4g__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM b3820a3a9eaf0434375c91c806132de3 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Late 1970s. Fannie’s Deli on 4718 W Touhy – two stores to the left of NY Bagles and Bialys. Marc worked here from 1978-1982 (or so), up to 60 hours a week Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story Description An account of the resource My Lincolnwood Story was an oral history project which aimed to explore the past and present of Lincolnwood by documenting stories of its residents. The main goal of this project was to record, preserve, and share audio interviews with the Lincolnwood community in order to connect residents with the history of their neighbors. This project presented Lincolnwood residents with an opportunity to share their story, and for all patrons – a chance to learn about the diverse community of Lincolnwood. Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource My Lincolnwood Story- Marc Zissman Subject The topic of the resource “I think I got interested in math and science [because of] the teachers. For me it started in first grade with Mrs. [Margaret] Johnson. She gave us these timed math tests.” Marc’s parents moved to Lincolnwood from Rogers Park when he was 3 years old. He recalls growing up in Lincolnwood, working at Fannie’s Deli, playing baseball and family traditions. After graduating from Niles West High School in 1981, he moved to Boston to study computer science at MIT and credits his love for math and science to the to the wonderful teachers he had in Lincolnwood schools. Click <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZwsnRE3Z2s" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer noopener">here</a> to view the film clip mentioned in the interview of Marc and his sister, Marla, playing at the Sinclair gas station dinosaur at the intersection of Pratt and Lincoln, May 8, 1967. This interview was recording using Zoom. The views and opinions expressed in interviews do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the Lincolnwood Public Library, including its Board of Trustees and staff. TRANSCRIPT: Lev Kalmens 0:00 My name is Lev Kalmens. I'm an Information Services Librarian at the Lincolnwood Public Library. Today is August 5 2020, and today I'm interviewing Mark Zissman for My Lincolnwood Story, our oral history project. Mark, thank you for joining me, and what is your Lincolnwood Story? Mark Zissman 0:17 I grew up in Lincolnwood. My parents moved and they lived in East Rogers Park. They got married in 1962. I was born in 1963. In 1966, when my mother was pregnant with my sister, they moved to Lincolnwood. They moved to a two flat apartment building at the corner of Pratt and Harding. There are nine such buildings right there, right across the street from the schools. We came to Lincolnwood in mid 1966. I lived there; I went to the Lincolnwood public schools, and went to Niles West. I graduated from Niles West and went to college in Boston. I've lived in the Boston area ever since. That's where I got married. That's where my wife and I raised our own children. That's where I've been. I guess my time in Lincolnwood was only about 16 years, but it was the 16 years of my childhood. Lev Kalmens 1:16 What do you remember about Lincolnwood growing up? Mark Zissman 1:20 It was a really great place for me to grow up. My first memory is when my sister was born, which was in January of 1967. What I remember a lot about that - women spent more time in the hospital then, maybe a week or so in the hospital - my mom was delayed coming back with my sister because of the big snowstorm in January of 1967, which was one of the largest snowstorms Chicago has ever had. It was on January 26. My mother spent another week in the hospital that she wouldn't have otherwise spent. My father and I were on our own. I don't remember a ton of details, but my father was from the old school of fathers who really couldn't...husbands who couldn't cook. I was three and a half years old. I remember going out looking for restaurants, walking to restaurants that were open at the corner of Lincoln and Crawford, and up and down Lincoln Avenue near our house. There was nothing open. We lived in this two family apartment building. It's been explained to me that the landlord of the building, the Josephs family, Mrs. Joseph, took pity on us and fed us a couple of meals until we were able to get around and until my mom came home. It was a lot of snow. I think that you have some video clips, some Super 8 movies, that my father took showing the cars and the school busses that were stuck in the snow that we could see from outside our apartment building. Lev Kalmens 2:58 Yeah, and in those clips, you can almost see where the library building is: the site of the current library building. Mark Zissman 3:10 That's right. I remember before the library was there was a Pier One. Before it was a Pier One, it was a Jewel grocery store. That wasn't the only place that my mother shopped, but that was one of the places. I'm not sure if we walked over there usually or she drove over there, but I remember being in that store. I remember the gas station across the street, and the dinosaur. The green dinosaur; there was more than one that was part of the Sinclair station. That was a good place to grow up because Pratt and Crawford is really the exact center, more or less, of Lincolnwood. Being so close to the schools - to Todd Hall, to Rutledge Hallm to Lincoln Hall - was very convenient. We spent a lot of time, not just at the schools, but playing at the various fields and playgrounds that were there. There were a lot of neighborhood boys and girls my age, and there was a lot of time playing together, either on the street, on Harding and East Prairie, or across the street at school. Lev Kalmens 4:09 Something that I noticed in that clip of you and your sister playing on the big dinosaur across the street here is how much busier this area seems because there was a grocery store. There were way more cars, and it seemed like there was more of a hustle and bustle than than there is now. Mark Zissman 4:26 Yeah, I guess you would know better the way it is now than I would, although I have been to the library a few times. It seemed busy to me, being a little boy and looking out the window from the second floor, out the big picture window, and watching the cars go by on Pratt and and Crawford. Seeing the distance was interesting. My dad would take public transportation get to work. He was an attorney. He worked downtown at a big Chicago bank, and he would always take public transportation. Around dinnertime, my mom would take my sister and me down - we'd walk to the end the of Harding to Harding and Lincoln Avenue, and the bus. I don't know if he sometimes he took the bus all the way downtown. Sometimes he took the bus to the subway, but we'd always wait for him to get off the bus coming home. Lincoln Avenue - the cars going by - it was interesting that we would sit there and wait for him for 10 minutes. We would sit on this curb, a little bit higher than a curb; that's on what is a cash register store. It was a cash register store, then called Schmaus. I think it still is now. Except now, when I go by there and I see the ledge that we sat on, it looks a lot smaller than I remember. But of course, it's exactly the same concrete ledge in their parking lot. That was one of the things that had been there since the beginning. There was been a restaurant across the street; many restaurants at Harding and Lincoln on the other side of the street. Lou Malnati's, I remember when they came. I remember Gabby Hartnett. We would go there to go bowling. There were other shops associated with that. I think that's been gone for a while. There was a lot of interesting stuff going on on Lincoln Avenue. That's how people got to Lincolnwood right before the expressway came in. Lev Kalmens 6:18 You mentioned your father was an attorney. Take me back a little bit about his family, your mother's family; how did they end up in Chicago, if they're from Chicago originally, or immigrated from Eastern Europe? Mark Zissman 6:30 Right. My father on his side, he was the first person born in the United States. His parents and grandparents were born in Eastern Europe, in Poland. They came at the turn of the previous century, a 1910 timeframe. They came directly to Chicago because there was a little bit of other family here already. It was natural for them to come. My father's parents were second cousins, so they knew each other, anyway. They came and they lived on the north side of Chicago; they lived on Lincoln Avenue, but much further south where Wrigley Field is today, Lincoln and Southport, that general area. My grandfather had a on that site a used furniture store, and a variety of stores, and also started gradually to accumulate a little bit of real estate around the time of the Depression. Then, they moved further north. My father went to college; he was the first person in our family to go to college. He went to grad school; he became an attorney, went to law school in Boston. They moved gradually further north into West Rogers Park, West Ridge, I guess you would say. When my parents got married being in East Rogers Park was a natural thing. On my mother's side, they were a South Side family. Their family had been here a little bit longer, a couple of generations. They came from Germany and from other Eastern European areas. My mother's father and his whole family was in the paint business, and what's called the paint sundries business. These are all the things like paint brushes and other things you need different from paint. They would sell that stuff to hardware stores, and then hardware stores would sell it to people. They ran that businesses on the South Side. My mom grew up in what's called South Shore, which is a South Side community. It's pretty far south, pretty close to Indiana, actually. My parents met because my mother's aunt knew the neighbors to my father's mother. There was some opportunities for them to connect by chance, and that's what happened. It was a Southside family and Northside family. It was also Jewish. The Southside family that was more German Jewish was what's called Reform Judaism, and they helped found a Reform synagogue down there, that's still there. It's right across from where President Obama lives on the South Side. My father's family was a little bit more traditional. It was in a sense of mixed marriage between a Reform family and a more traditional family. That was a little bit difficult at the time, but interesting. Subsequently, my sister and I both are much more traditional [inaudible]. That's the side that won. But we're mindful of this Reform movement, and of the impact on our mother's side that they had in that community at that time on the South Side. Lev Kalmens 9:56 Talk to me a bit about the various family traditions you had growing up. Mark Zissman 10:01 My sister and I were for a long time, for 10 years, the only grandchildren on both sides of the family; the only grandson and the only granddaughter. As my wife says that leads to certain sense of entitlement as a child because we were the centers of attention. My mother would have barbecues in the backyard for Memorial Day and July 4; we would do cookouts and so on. There were a lot of Jewish holidays, Passover and the Jewish High Holidays that come in the fall, and Hanukkah that comes into winter, where everybody would come over, and we would eat together. My mother would make these great meals, or we might be at one of my grandmother's house instead sometimes. Outdoor picnics were also great. My great grandparents would come over: my great grandparents, my grandmother of my father's mother's mother, and both of her parents. I can remember that very well, for a long time. We would see them a lot. They lived also in West Rogers Park; we would go to their house, they would go come to our house. It was a big deal. It was just really nice to get everybody together. We got everybody together all the time. It was interesting that both sides of the family, my perspective was, that both sides of the family got along very well. There was a lot of respect, because to me, they were family; but they hadn't known each other all that long when I was little and yet, they got along very well. There was great respect between them. I remember my grandparents worked really hard. My mother's father would come over and sit in the backyard, have a hot dog, and he would fall asleep on Sunday because he was working so hard during the week in a way that I couldn't possibly understand. My father's father, the same thing was true. My father's father had grown up in Poland in a in a house; it didn't even have a floor. It had a dirt floor. To go from that to having your son, my father, go to law school and become a lawyer, and my mother to get a master's degree and become a teacher is a really big step. That's kind of the American dream. It is the American dream. It wasn't obvious to me what was happening or what had happened, what they had achieved, all of them. But it's obvious. It's clear to me now, and it's very impressive. Lev Kalmens 12:37 You mentioned your father was a lawyer, and your mother was a teacher. Do you know where she taught? Mark Zissman 12:42 She taught in lots of places. What I remember the most is that she taught in the north part of Chicago; there was a place called Lawrence Hall, which was a school for boys. I don't know if it was a high school exactly; it was a place where boys could come who were in trouble. It was at Lawrence and Kedzi, in that general area. She worked there. She had previously been a nursery school teacher also; I remember she did that for a while. After my sister and I were old enough where we could be home alone, that's when she went back to get her master's degree. On her side of the family she and her brother were the first ones to graduate college. She taught until I remember going to college. [Inaudible] Lev Kalmens 13:33 Talk to me a little bit about going to the schools here in Lincolnwood, with Todd Hall and all the way going up to Niles West. Mark Zissman 13:39 I remember I went to nursery school at the JCC, the Jewish Community Center, which is at Touhy and McCormick near Kedzie. At the time that I went it was actually pretty new. There were a lot of people from Lincolnwood; a lot of kids from Lincolnwood went there. We had a carpool. Different moms would drive on different days, take the kids back and forth. I went there for a couple years, and then started at Todd Hall with all the other kids in the neighborhood. I remember a big bus that took us from Harding and Pratt to Todd Hall, which would have been faster to walk. But that's what they did at that time. I remember all of my teachers there and I have been in touch with, for example, Mrs. Johnson. Mrs. Margaret Johnson. She was a phenomenal first grade teacher. She taught both my sister and me, and that true of many families. My mom and Mrs. Johnson were in touch until just a few years ago when Mrs. Johnson passed away. I remember Mrs. Johnson had a son named Mark. Maybe she looked at me kindly. She was a wonderful person to teach you how to read and to teach you math. She was just an outstanding teacher and I think it was recognized in the school system. But I had lots of outstanding teachers like that. I had [inaudible] teacher called Mr. Niccolo, but she's now Poppy Woodard. She's a teacher now down in Alabama. She taught me third, fourth and fifth grade. In fourth grade and fifth grade, the reason we stayed together was in fourth grade and fifth grade they had something called [inaudible]. I don't remember exactly what that stood for, but they were pods where they taught third, fourth and fifth graders together. They knocked down some walls. It was pod A, pod B, pod C. Miss Niccolo and Mrs. [inaudible] did pod C and I was in that for fourth and fifth grade. It was a multi grade classroom, which was pretty cool. It was very individualized learning. I'm sure it was very experimental at the time. I think they got rid of it. I don't think it lasted very long. It was it was there while I was there. That was pretty interesting. That was a great experience. Ms. Niccolo, I'm still in touch with her. I've actually been down in Alabama and Montgomery where she lives. I've gone out to dinner with her and with her daughter down there. She's finishing up a long career in teaching. Then, that was a great place to be. In Lincoln Hall, I became a sort of a math science person. Although all the teachers were really good, I especially remember Mr. Rubin and Mr. Pollster, Dr. Rogers - Monica Rogers the music teacher - they're just outstanding. When I eventually got into college, I remember Mr. Pollster used to have these different extra credit projects like computing 2 to the 420th power or computing 100 factorial. Back in those days, you had to do it by hand. I never completed either of those questions, but people did. He would grade you or whatever. I finally got to college with access to computers. I printed out both 2 to the 420th power and 100 factorial. I sent them in to Mr. Pollster; it was four years late. I sent them in and asked I know it's four years late, but we please accept this, such as it was. Those were really great science teachers. Mr. Willison is an English teacher, really great English teacher. We had great teachers at Niles West when I was there, 1977 to 1981. It was large already. Then they closed Niles East. They had to split the Niles East kids and sent half to West and roughly half to North. By the time I graduated as a senior, there might have been 700 kids in our graduating class. Almost 3000 kids in the school. I was thinking especially on the science and math teachers - Mr. Hutton or Mr. Martin - and Mrs. Graham, the English teacher I had as a senior, were just outstanding. When I went to college, I was very well prepared. In some cases we were using, at least the first year, the same book that we had used the last year of high school. It was cool to have to have done that it; it made it easier. Lev Kalmens 18:01 How did you get interested in math and science in the first place, do you think? Mark Zissman 18:05 I think I got interested in math and science because...it wasn't because my family did that. Because my dad was a lawyer, my mom was a teacher, there was no engineering; no science in my family background. I think it's the teachers that do that. It started in first grade with Mrs. Johnson. She gave us these timed math tests. It was interesting. She gave us a lot of different kinds of work we can do that I found kind of interesting. For me, that lasted all the way all the way into high school. It was always interesting, Like Mr. Priven doing these leaf identification things. He would make us take notes, this was in seventh grade. Anybody who had him remembers this, you had to go in and take notes on what he was telling you in seventh grade. About three, four times a year, you would turn those notes in, and he would grade your notes. He's grading you on how well you were paying attention to what he said, and he knew what he told you each day. And then he would turn it back to you: "September 10, you must have been asleep. I don't like this. I don't like this. " That's pretty valuable. It's separate from what subject it is; how to take notes is a pretty valuable skill to have. Mr. Pulser, it sounds crazy, but he would have Guinness Book of World Records contests in class where he would show up and say, "Today, we're talking about part of the Guinness Book; the top the tallest men and the heaviest and the shortest and this and that." Then he would ask us questions about that. You would say, "Well, how important is it to know the facts that are in the Guinness Book of Records? It's not very important, probably." But how important is it to be able to read something and, in some cases, retain the facts so that you have the recall of them later. That is pretty important. Later in high school, in history we would have history teachers that would say, "I don't really care about the facts; I want you to understand the progression of history," which is also important. They're both important. I found that the teachers that I had were pretty clever and pretty creative in how they were able to make sure that we were interested in what we were doing. Lev Kalmens 20:29 So you went to college? You said you've been in Boston since college? Was that somewhere you've always wanted to go? How did you end up in Boston? Mark Zissman 20:38 I'm not really sure. We visited a few places and the place where I went is a very good engineering university. I guess that was it. They accepted me and I actually still work there. I've never left the Boston area. I work at the university where I went as a freshman although I focus on research, not on teaching. This is where I met my wife. It turned out it was hard to do the kind of work that I do anywhere else. There weren't many places I could do it. We liked it there; it's different. Boston is different. It's older. The community we live in, not that it's that old, was settled in the early 1700s. My wife is a teacher, too. She's done a history of this area, so we understand the history very well. Although our house isn't that old, it's only from the 50s, there are houses here from the 1700s that people still live in. The community has changed. It's not the same as it was, but we kind of like it. It's nice; not too different from Lincolnwood in some ways, Lev Kalmens 21:47 Do you still have a connection...do you still have family that lives here in Lincolnwod, in the Chicagoland area? Mark Zissman 21:52 In the Chicago area, sure. I have a lot of friends that espeically now we do a lot of Zooming. My family is very involved in the LIncolnwood Jewish congregation. I've been in touch with Rabbi Learfield there. I visit when I'm in town, which hasn't been recently, of course. We did our first ever reunion of our Hebrew school graduating class; it was the 44th year since we graduated. We did it by Zoom. It was going to be in person, but we couldn't do it in person. It was going to be the spring. So we did it by Zoom. It's good to keep in touch with all those folks. I worked for four or five years at a deli on to Touhy called Fanny's. I've been in touch a little bit. That was a defining four years for me in high school. I learned a lot at Fanny's; I learned at least as much at Fanny's for what I would need for the rest of my life, as I did in high school, honestly. That was really great. I'm in touch with folks from there as well. I have close friends that lived in Lincolnwood; a couple still do. One of my friends, Neil, lives just a few blocks from where he grew up. His kids went through all the same schools. His wife teaches at Todd Hall in what what he thinks of as Mr. Coochies' class, the kindergarten class from 40 years ago, 50 years ago. I'm in touch with a lot of those folks. Not everybody but a lot of us. Lev Kalmens 23:16 Have you had a chance to bring your own children to Lincolnwood? Mark Zissman 23:20 Oh, yeah. My kids know very well. They've both been to the synagogue many times, they've both met Rabbi Learfield. They've led some of the services there. I don't think they've ever been inside the schools, but they know the schools. We pass the high school on the Edens Expressway all the time. Our older son, who's a himself a civil engineer, knows quite a bit about how the north side of Chicago was developed. He went to Northwestern so he spent four years in the area. He knows quite a bit about the history of Evanston, the history of the whole north side in Chicago, how it was developed, how and why they put the expressway where they put it; all the things like that. In some sense, he knows probably more than I do actually about that. Lev Kalmens 24:05 You told me you had somewhat of a fascination or like an obsession with local history. You mentioned...was it Fanny's, the place? What are some of the other businesses that you recall from growing up? Mark Zissman 24:22 I recall lots of them. Places like the [inaudible], like Gabby Hartman. Fanny's for me was a big thing. The Pier One, the Jewel, and the library itself. [When] I grew up there wasn't a library. There wasn't a fire department. There wasn't even what we call the big park before it was renamed Prosel Park. There wasn't a swimming pool at first. These are all things that were important, and somebody had to do that. It turned out that I grew up right on Harding right across the street from Mrs. Madeline Grant who ultimately became the mayor. When I knew her, and of course I knew her kids, she was one of the movers behind the library in the first place. The library wasn't even where is now; it was in the wedge between Pratt and Lincoln Avenue just a little bit to the West. It was in some other building that had been a bank or something before it moved. I don't even think the library existed as it exists now before I went to college. Everybody would go to the Skokie library; the kids would go to the Skokie library to do homework or the Northwestern library. Lev Kalmens 25:29 I believe there was a referendum to approve a library in Lincolnwood in in the very late 70s. I think the library, as an independent building, opened in the early 80s. Mark Zissman 25:44 I was already gone. The restaurants - the Ground Round that started as a Howard Johnson's then became a Ground Round - this is at Lincoln Avenue and Crawford. That is now one of the Grossinger car agencies. There was always a Cadillac agency at the corner of Pratt and Crawford, which I think now is also Grossinger affiliated with them. The stores on Touhey, I know all the stores on Touhy between Crawford and East Prairie on both sides of the street. The Baskin Robbins ice cream store. There was Galens Pharmacy; there were a lot of gas stations. There was another deli; they're a different deli, Manny's, etc. The kids would get around on bicycles for the most part and go to all these places. I think there's still the Long John Silver's; [it] was there for a long time. It may be gone. There was a different place called [inaudible] before that. Kids have nothing to do; they just ride their bicycles around stopping at something. Lev Kalmens 26:33 And that's what I've heard from talking to other people. Baseball was always a big thing. I don't know if you played baseball here in the summers. Mark Zissman 27:01 Yeah. I did Little League in the spring for a couple years, and then at Niles West I wrestled. What I remember doing more was on Saturday morning all the way through middle school, even in elementary school, the schools provided Saturday morning athletics for at least for the boys, maybe for the girls, too. It was football, flag football, in the fall, and then basketball in the winter, inside. I remember doing that every week for years. Some of the same teachers - Mr. Willison the gym teacher, Mr. [inaudible], Mr. Mauer, and others - that would coach that. It was very informal. You didn't really sign up for it; you just showed up, and there would be some amount of practicing. There would be pickup games that they would referee or whatever. It would be between nine and 12. We did that all the time, every every week. Not every week, but most weeks, for a lot of years. Mostly the boys that I remember in Lincolnwood, especially the ones in my neighborhood. There were a lot of boys my age, right there on Harding and East Prairie, and then out from there. There was always a lot of kids to play with. There were some famous people, of course. There's the current drummer for Styx. Todd Zuckerman who lived right behind us. You should try to get a history from Todd or from his brother; probably better from his older brother. He has two older brothers. His older brother, Paul, would be a good person for you to talk to. He's in Wisconsin now and, he could tell you about what it was like growing up. Very interesting. Great family, very musical family. Lev Kalmens 28:43 It sounds like the amount of smaller businesses as compared to now where you look at Lincoln Avenue and there's a lot of buildings that the tenants keep on rotating or places have been torn down. You paint a completely different picture of what Lincolnwood is now kind of full of. Mark Zissman 29:05 I guess that's right. It was always a mystery. I think it was a good thing because it kept taxes down. It was all what I call light industry. That was east of Hamlin, and then north of that, and south of Howard. This whole area and the existence of that and the tax base that that created was able to keep the taxes down on the residents who live there. But, for the kids, looking at all those buildings like Bell & Howell and Ditto and Accurate Fasteners - I don't remember all the names of them - Illinois Tool Works. When you interviewed Mrs. Smith, she talked about before all of that happened and what that was like. I didn't know that, but that was there. But to me, it was not interesting. It was confusing. What is all that stuff? What do they actually do at these places? Some of the buildings looked a little scary. It really wasn't useful. But, The Bunny Hutch and the novelty golf and the Dairy Queen, and all the other little places that there were. There was a pet store; there were lots of cool places. I guess I don't know how many of those are there at this point or not. But there was a lot to do. I'm [inaudble] a lot to do on Touhey from top to bottom. That was different because Pratt didn't have the bridge over the channel. Because of that - that was a whole big deal about why they didn't want the bridge - although it was a busy street, it wasn't as busy as those other ones and it was only really residential. I think the park in the summer, that Prosel Park, was really the core. That park, although I only went a couple times, it offered very inexpensive summer camp programs, free or a couple dollars for the whole summer. All the kids would ride their bikes there in the morning. Maybe they'd have to go home and go back. I don't remember now. They were in the pool. Once the pool was there, you could go in the morning and never leave. You could stay all afternoon at the pool, whether you were learning at the pool or whether you were just hanging out. That pool was a wonderful, wonderful thing. We actually don't have that where I live in. I live now in suburban Boston; although it's very similar to Lincolnwood a lot of ways, it's pool is not that nice. It has a pool; it's far away. My kids could never ride their bikes there. It's not centrally located and it wasn't nearly as nice. The pool and the centralized park that had a lot of tennis courts, also, is a cool thing. That's a really good thing to have. I remember on Halloween it would be chaotic at the park. I don't know why, but they would have all the kids come. There'd be hot dogs and hamburgers and a huge bonfire. Then the kids would get into trouble after that. How could you bring all the kids together on Halloween and then expect them to...not terrible trouble. But how could you ...whatever. That's what it was. It was a lot of fun. Lev Kalmens 32:18 It's interesting, you mention...well, now it's Dairy Star, which is a very popular ice cream place. Do you have memories of going to that Dairy Queen? Mark Zissman 32:27 Dairy Queen, I remember. I didn't go there as often as the Baskin Robbins, the 31 Flavors. We went there all the time; I almost worked there instead of Fanny's. I got a job; I got an offer. It was a little bit less money, probably like $2 instead of $2.50; I don't remember exactly. You could tell, even at the time, that my opportunities at Baskin Robbins were going to be limited. The opportunities at the deli were unlimited. It was a good choice to go with the deli. We went there more. There was a Rubens deli that was right down from the Baskin Robbins, which we would go to occasionally. But I think that the where my mom would always buy our milk with a milk pail. My parents would send me in there. I was pretty little, and my dad would say milk was $1.30. Because it's a loss leader; because it was the only thing that we bought. I had to go in there...my mom would tell me get 1% or get 2%, one 2% milk. We wanted in the plastic or whatever it was, and we want to change from the $2. It needed to be right. That's a lot to remember when you're little; it's heavy. I'd have to try to remember what kind of which milk it was; I have to try to make sure that change was right and then bring it back out. We would do that every week. We went there a lot; we didn't find much else there. But the post office...one thing that's exactly the same. The post office. Although the zip code changed, the post office is still where it was. I remember when there used to be there was this really big Kmart-like store called Community. That was across from Kiddieland, which everybody also remembers if they grew up around that time. Kiddieland and Community were there. Kiddieland closed at some point. The Community, I don't know if it's a Home Depot or whatever it is. Lev Kalmens 33:32 It is. Mark Zissman 34:16 And, of course, Lincoln Village. All the kids would go to Lincoln Village; it was wonderful. I remember when they built the theater. I remember sneaking with my friends to see the R rated movies; Saturday Night Fever is an example there. It was really nice. It was this big white three story-ish big thing. I think at first it was all just one theater in there, and then eventually they split it up into the multiples. Lincoln Village was great. I bought my first stereo at the audio store. We got all the clothes that we bought. We got a lot of stuff. Lev Kalmens 34:57 What is something that you're most proud of? Mark Zissman 34:59 I'm proud of my wife and what my children, they're 30 years old now, have accomplished. I've accomplished some, but like I said, it was pretty easy. It was pretty easy for me. My accomplishments are not significant, really, compared to my parents and my grandparents. [Inaudible] I'm proud to have children that are contributing members of society, that I'm a contributing member of society at some level. It's all good. It's been a good life so far. I enjoyed my time in Lincolnwood. That said, everything wasn't perfect in Lincolnwood, either. I'm sure others have talked about this, but the level of diversity was very limited. Diversity in Lincolnwood at that time, was if there were Jewish people as well as Christian people. That was diversity. There were very few Asian people. I don't remember any African Americans. Maybe there were a couple. I think that has changed. When I visited the schools...the schools did an open house about 10 years ago. You could go around and get get into Todd Hall, Rutledge Hall and Lincoln Hall if you were an alumnus or anybody could. That was very interesting, talking to the administrators and the teachers who were there about how things had changed, I think was pretty interesting. That is likely a change for the best. It was actually a little bit more diverse at Niles West, a little bit more than Lincolnwood. Even socio-economically it was more diverse there. So that was probably better. I don't think a lot about what I'm most proud of, but I am happy. I do think very fondly about my childhood, as Mrs. Smith said, although she grew up 30 years earlier. I knew her son Ron. Lincolnwood was a great place to grow up, and for her great place to live as an adult. For me, a great place to visit, to come back to occasionally. Lev Kalmens 37:11 I want to thank you for taking the time to speak with me, and share your Lincolnwood Story with us. Mark Zissman 37:16 Thank you very much.